Last Democratic debate until Iowa

Yang lost his Yin 

Ladies and gentlemen start your engines

Bernie's Smokin' takin' in lotsa cash

front runner bernie sanders looking to take yet another debate. 

who'd have thought the nastiest campaign move would've come from warren? sad. 

^ apparently he doesn't think a woman can be president (in his own words)

Damn bernie, I thought you might be better than that.

Warren confirmed it happened, but isn't gonna dig in on it, because beating trump is more important.

that's not what was said and of course you would think that. haha. 

It's everywhere man.

i guess you are a dumb fuck. what can ya do. 

Warren and Bernie should be entertaining.....

Elizabeth Warren, back in July, discussing her friendship with Bernie Sanders: “Bernie and I have been friends for a long, long time,” said Warren in an interview, insisting their civil relationship will carry over to the debate stage. “I can’t imagine why it wouldn’t.”

I guess she didn’t have much of an imagination:

"Senator Elizabeth Warren of Massachusetts said on Monday night that Senator Bernie Sanders of Vermont told her in 2018 he did not think a woman could win the presidency. Ms. Warren’s description of the comment, from a private one-on-one meeting, represents a remarkable salvo at her leading liberal rival in the 2020 race just three weeks before the Iowa caucuses.

Mr. Sanders vehemently denied making the remark earlier on Monday and accused the Warren campaign staff of “lying” about it, in a statement intended to refute a news report by CNN that relied on anonymous sources. The New York Times and other outlets confirmed the CNN report on Monday afternoon, while the Warren campaign initially declined to comment."

I find myself in the odd position of feeling like Heath Ledger’s Joker. This was his assessment of the ethics of the people of Gotham City: “See, their morals, their ‘code’? It’s a bad joke, dropped at the first sign of trouble. They’re only as good as the world allows them to be. I’ll show you. When the chips are down, these, uh, these ‘civilized people,’ they’ll eat each other. See, I’m not a monster. I’m just ahead of the curve . . .”

https://www.nationalreview.com/the-morning-jolt/the-political-infighting...

And for those of you who don't think it happened.....

Warren Says Sanders Told Her a Woman Could Not Win the Presidency

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/01/13/us/politics/bernie-sanders-elizabeth-...

"Bernie is doing well in the Iowa and NH polls and has a real shot at taking this. "

Please God make it so.  It's almost like you want Trump re-elected.

thom supports white nationalism. lol. 

I would've rather him said I don't remember that conversation but if I did... I apologize because I don't believe that.

But he didn't, he vehemently denied it and called it ludicrous.

Here's her official statement, you decide.
 

Yay it’s more propaganda from everyone’s favorite local racist!

which dem candidate DO you think could take down chump thomas?

besides warren lying, which is just sad, she knows she has no chance at the dem domination, let alone beating trump in the general, so she's helping biden at this point. fucked up. 

not something a friend does, disgraceful lie, but she also didn't endorse in 2016, something else a great friend would've done. warren true colors have shown.

most people see through the lies tho, which is why she's been tanking for the past handful of months; but thod of course you don't. 

to paint bernie as sexist is a total weak move, unfortunate, and she'll certainly have no place in a bernie administration. her campaign is over. 

imagine believing bernie doesn't think a woman could be president, incredible. it's just everything he's says is the opposite of that lie. haha. 

nevada largest teachers union, 5th largest school district in the country, endorsed bernie this morning. 

teachers know. 

8.3 

bro.

That was a pretty trumpian rant there.

Here's what I said:

"Here's her official statement, you decide."

I don't know if that happened in their conversation, do you?
Were you there?

Stand by your man

- Tammy Wynette

#believewomen

what's trumpian is what warren did. 

you said : 

^ apparently he doesn't think a woman can be president (in his own words)

Damn bernie, I thought you might be better than that.

you just look like a fool for typing that. nothing like centrists weaponizing women's issues. 

I'm All in on Bernie !!!

Tulsi lost me at "Present" (I can admit when I'm wrong)

He called Warren a liar and that's something YOU don't know did or didn't happened.

What does Warren get out of that? 
 

Again...
I would've rather him said "I don't remember that conversation but if I did... I apologize because I don't believe that".

But he didn't, he vehemently denied it and called it "ludicrous".

#believewomen

my morning democracy show has been moved and replaced by some horrid pro-hillary knitting circle blathering on about bernie blah blah, russia, blah blah...absolute rubbish.

That sucks turtle.

>>> nothing like centrists weaponizing women's issues. <<<
 

Here's food for thought...

Maybe Bernie will be asked about the comments of his Iowa field organizer....

“Like, yeah, you know, I like Bernie, but I really want a woman to be -, it’s like, wait, so like you’re okay with a woman if she has worse policies. Like just because she’s a woman, because she has a vagina, that’s why you’re going to vote for her?"

I have no inside information, but I would find it understandable if anyone would be skeptical about the likelihood that Americans (particularly given the current state of the electoral system) are not yet ready to choose a female president not named Palin.

I'm half joking, but the recent Frontline episodes are fresh in my mind (tribalism, unfounded fears, and public spectacle are real).

I encourage all to check them out (very sobering):

https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/frontline/

That's the same bullshit they were talking about in 2016.

Why do you thinks the democrats took back the house in 2018?

Women voters

Women candidates (record amount) that won!

Get the fuck outta here with that shit.

T.O.D.,

Looking at the statement that you posted, I see this quote:  "I thought a woman could win; he disagreed."

IMHO, the media (and everyone else) is blowing this way out of proportion to cause unnecessary fear/concern and divisiveness.

As stated by Ms. Warren, it's a difference of opinion, IMHO.

PS: I have been waiting for the field to dwindle down before I start following these campaigns.  Looks like I'm starting to pay attention at the right time.

May the best candidate win...

Johnny D, you may think the media etc... are blowing this out of proportion, but women aren't.

P-nutz?

 

good little centrist, thod. think what the corporate media tells you to. you always do. word for word. 

I appreciate your feedback, T.O.D.

I'll check in with my wife, who is a very good barometer on this subject. 

Ken, I appreciate your post. I'm just worried about the things beyond my control, like those swing states.  I think that any infighting on the Dem's side is potentially dangerous 

thod we've been over this -- you have been discredited, done. dismissed. for months you've posted extreme links about bernie and russia, by foaming at the mouth establishment hacks. your recent link from last week was absolutely sad tbh, haha. you look really bad man. get your shit together. 

anyway, what happened to party unity, centrists? 

this is a nasty smear job by warren, who is desperate at this point -- so she attacks the leading candidate who is supposedly on the same side? strange. this is already backfiring and just makes the movement more potent. hilarious. 

warren will absolutely not get people to show up like bernie, not even close, nobody does. not even trump. 

here ya go TOD

https://fair.org/home/cnns-sanders-hit-piece-doesnt-pass-the-smell-test/

Thanks turtle.

Here you go.

who the hell is leah mcelrath and why should i pay attention to her opinions?

"unnamed sources" in cnn establishment media (aka corporate media)....hit piece.

hahahahha

keep em coming thod. 

this is so bad that even the people who typically dislike bernie are calling out warren's bs. 

this takes her campaign down. strange move. 

and CNN is straight trash. 

^^^^In all fairness (no pun intended), that fair.org article is from yesterday and we now have Warren's statement. 

seems like thinking a woman "cant win the presidency" is more likely to be a reflection on america's willingness to elect a woman and not a reflection on a womans ability to become president, and it seems like they are taking a totally innocent and valid opinion and trying to paint bernie as a sexist to the millions of people that are just skimming news headlines on social media and not reading the actual articles or considering any kind of context.

they are not overtly lying, claiming bernie is an outright sexist, or distorting any quotes, but they know full well that just skimming the article, or reading a headline or two about this in passing will plant the subconscious seeds that bernie might be a sexist, or at least painfully old fashioned.

>>> who the hell is leah mcelrath and why should i pay attention to her opinions? <<<


Just some woman that's actually not a bot but because she's an enemy of the trump admin and 

doesn't get a twitter (check).

It's just one woman, go ahead and destroy her.

and why you should listen to women feeling this way?
I didn't think you would.

bernie is the most electable. 

As I recall a woman beat trump by close to 3 million votes.

bernie in 1st in CA/nh/iowa/nv, and surging still.

warren (and thod) desperate. 

Thod and Thom ought to take a long walk off a short pier together.

P-nutz

turtle

whoever?
 

The Bernie camp squashed this after running it all day Saturday in 2 early voting states.

Sanders camp admits anti-Warren script was deployed in multiple early states

Sanders initially attributed the talking points to rogue staffers, and supporters launched an online campaign to convince people the document was fake.

DES MOINES, Iowa — The controversial talking points attacking Elizabeth Warren that Bernie Sanders' campaign deployed were given to teams in at least two early voting states on Friday, three Sanders campaign officials confirmed.

Volunteers and staffers used the script on Saturday while canvassing for votes, meaning the talking points were more official than what Sanders previously suggested after POLITICO reported on the language.

https://www.politico.com/amp/news/2020/01/14/sanders-admits-anti-warren-...

Once again, those rogue staffers.

Keep hitting the "Submit" button, champ.

hillary lost tod, get over it.

she is just some "PERSON". 

i can get a twitter account too, i have opinions....

and get the projected misogyny outta here. i raised 2 daughters. 

If you only mattered kid.

"When you can't argue the facts, pound the table"

don't make this about me, quit hiding behind your kids turtle,

we're talking about politics.

you either get it? 
or 

pound the table.

what's clear is you do not get it.

what we are talking about is hillary supporters are still butt hurt and reaching. 

because some lady is on twitter, she speaks for all women? she has insight others do not?

i am "hiding" behind my kids? from what? you?  lol.

If only, if only.

Hit the submit button again. You're a one man circle jerk.

Now, eat the cracker.

If only > Table Jam

you brought up that you have 2 daughters, implying you can't be a sexist/misogynist, when we're talking

about politics.

>>> because some lady is on twitter, she speaks for all women? she has insight others do not? <<<
 

never said that, nor did I bring up my daughters.

if you believe that other women don't feel the same way, i don't know what to tell ya bro. 
 

Cool.

Now hit submit again and change exactly zero minds.

I would've rather him said "I don't remember that conversation but if I did... I apologize because I don't believe that".

But he didn't, he vehemently denied it and called it "ludicrous".

#believewomen

#3rdpartywives

#believewomen

i brought up the subject of having daughters because you insinuated that i was "not listening to her because she is a woman". 

look i have to go fight closed minded right wingers, i don't have time to convert obtuse hillary man-dems.

could've not even responded, no hate here.

Thod, tell us more how women feel lol. This guy will believe any kind of trash NYT publishes. Warren lies man. She's been known to do it a lot. Just another lie that won't get her anywhere. Sad publicity stunt for a dying campaign.

#believewomenlikeleeanntweeden

Do I know what your woman thinks?

can't/won't even speculate.

^Thod, you should just vote for Steyer 

#believewomen

Warren just pulled peeps away from Bernie in Iowa by supporting new NAFTA Not allot of environmentalist's in Iowa

Warren killing it!

Warren/Klobuchar

This debate is boring as shit.

That's the first debate I've seen for the upcoming election.

My sentimental favorite was Klobuchar tonight, but I figure that she doesn't have much of a chance.

Seemed to me that Bernie was the most engaging one up there.

rough night for thod, jesus. warren, too.

she doesn't look good man. trump gets the popular and electoral against warren -- this doesn't matter tho, she has zero chance of becoming the nominee and only to hand the election to trump. this is good news, centrists.

the voting will certainly be fun. lots of melting on the way. 

<<<>>>#believewomen

take your own advice. 

bernie's base is majority female, has more female staffers than any other candidate.

If I were to go to Elizabeth Warren's house and look in her refrigirator, what do you think I would find?

And ToD, you know I am one of your supporters but even you must see that you're being a complete ass up in here. Please stop

Idiots like Turtle and Slacker who constantly cry on the zone about how tough life is and how expensive cost of living is, ironically are willing to pay 50% income tax and 40% sales tax by voting for their utopian messiah Bernie.  True critical thinkers here.

^Sounds like you're trying to call out zones about crying and whining while crying and whining yourself. Nicely done

Feel like Bernie got cornered by this move by Warren (or whoever), making it a pretty crafty political move (in a machiavellian sense). I can imagine him saying, in the context of a conversation, something to the effect of "right now Trump's going to exploit any political prejudices he can find, and he can use the fodder of his 'defeat' of Hillary, which means it would be hard for a woman to win now, so no, I don't think a woman can win right now".

Obviously, I'm guessing, but I think it's pretty clear that Bernie is a feminist and always has been. If you question that, well, I don't know what to tell you. So by releasing this alleged quote, he has two choices: 1) spend a ton of energy acknowledging that he said it but clarifying the context. This is political suicide. The only thing that would remain in the popular imagination is yes, I said it. So option 2) lie and deny it, which unfortunately, I think is what's going on. Here Bernie's integrity is damaged and that is ultimately the end-game of this whole maneuver. Bernie's thing is that he has 100% integrity, or as humanly close to it as possible (IMO). By going for his integrity is how you shake the undecideds, the moderates and people on the bench between Warren and Sanders.

racket, take a breath man. you post nonsense, lies. just like trump. what you post is trash lies. poo poo mouth. you have some shit on your lips you little bitch. clean the fuck up. 

over 100,000 donations yesterday haha. can't stop it this time guys. 

bernie knows warren would get crushed by trump, everybody sees that. she's a terribly weak candidate for a general, she doesn't stand for anything. 

but to lable him sexist? haha. she must've cut a deal w/ biden. none of this makes sense, but she's done now. weird. 

Even Van Jones is dispirited by this pathetic group of losers.....

CNN’s Van Jones Buries 2020 Field After Debate: ‘Nothing I Saw Tonight Would Be Able to Take Donald Trump Out’

CNN’s Van Jones tonight said he was dispirited by the Democratic debate and that nothing he saw from any of the candidates looked like any of them could beat President Donald Trump.

“As a progressive, to see those two [Warren and Sanders] have that level of vitriol was very dispiriting. And I want to say that tonight for me was dispiriting. Democrats got to do better than what we saw tonight. There was nothing I saw tonight that would be able to take Donald Trump out, and I want to see a Democrat in the White House as soon as possible.

https://www.mediaite.com/tv/cnns-van-jones-buries-2020-field-after-debat...

As a self described Communist, Mr. Jones really should have a better grasp of progressive history.  The left always eats its own first, it's the only way that they can eliminate the competition on their side of the aisle.

Read up on what happened to the Mensheviks, Van.

Jesus, what a mess. First off, what the hell was Warren's camp thinking, coming out with some asinine "he said / she said" bullshit just before the debate? It's the stupidest shit imaginable.

Secondly, could Bernie have reacted better? It wasn't a good moment for him.

 Last night they both acted like 6th graders who got sent to the principal's office. Neither showed decorum or class, and they both looked  like idiots. And all over some supposed comment that may or may not have happened in private chambers?

Warren was a twat for coming out with that BS. Bernie was a twat for his reaction. Warren was more of a twat though. A sad display all around.

Bernie wins!

Warren is a Govt Mule (Just joking)

Joe is incoherent 

Andrew is immature 

Amy sounds like everybody's know it all 3rd grade teacher

Thom wants to buy some more TV time before he drops out

Pete is a good VP pick

  Bernie Wins!

You're assuming she released it, BK. IMO, it hurts her potentially as much as it benefits her potentially. It feels more like a leak from someone(s) who want to create interference in the clean candidacies they've been running so far. Pit them against each other, sow division or at least the illusion thereof and thereby split the ranks. I don't think it can work, in any case - Bernie's got too much steam AND evidence behind him already. I don't think it'll dent him, but it probably will dent Warren because society is still sexist. 

I don't know if twat is really the word you wanna go with under these particular circumstances, but hey, you do you. :)

I was ready for a war and barely got a skirmish. And while the dems continue to dance, the enemy mobilizes. In my state, Ct's so had it with this asshole, the top 5 dems beat him by double digits, we'll get behind whichever one gets picked. Ct wants trump out, bigly.  In 16 I voted Bernie, then HRC for all the good it did. On voting day I'll get behind whoever's got the full steam mojo momentum going to beat lord farquad. If Bernie, great. But if not, I'd be fine with whoever the dems choose.

I like that word vitriol 

fits these days. And fits Zoner political comments these days

i believe in passion,  but.......

Hey   Take this test 

I was a bit surprised as an independent with my scores

https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/politics/policy-2020/quiz-which-...

who will beat trump is priority #1   Where is our jfk?

My favorite debate was jfk vs Johnson in 64?

i have been fairly illiterate and not inclined to watch much of these debates 

uninspired or worried 

altruistic or common sense

greedy for big change or realistic

I was using "twat" in a British accent. It has a different connotation than the way we use it.

Racket has been paying 40% tax for literally nothing his whole life (until 55 or whatever age you can collect Medicare and SS) but paying 50% for benefits that can help you right now as far as an education and in the future when you will absolutely need medical coverage is insanity right? 

Perhaps a decent quick summary

https://apple.news/APTCHMVXORrWcISUNKVLn2g

i personally am still in the woods, but leaning a bit centrist   More than I might have in the past

My age? Or candidates that do not inspire me or give a high degree of confidence to either win or to lead effectively and restore out tarnished world wide image (and are too old)

so keep paying taxes that billionaires and corporations should be shouldering while getting little to nothing for it...

move to texas ya fucking cunt racket.

vote centrist in the primary = voting trump and holding the country back. 

do the right thing LLTD. 

vote centrist in the primary = voting trump and holding the country back. 

Like all those '16 Bernie primary voters who helped elect Trump in the general?

Spare us your lectures.

Hey, come the general, this bernie-warren brouhaha will be like ancient history....just smile and punch that Biden/Kamala ticket. And bring your friends.

bluestnote your centrist establishment dems gave us trump. 

spare us your stupidity. let's not repeat the same mistake. 

Asshat insists on deciding who is "centrist" despite not knowing shit.

I voted for Bernie, dipshit.

bernie now beats trump by 6 points in FL. biden 2. Florida. 

warren lol. just hoping to be biden's vp pick now, sorry stuff from her.

Bernie has showed the utmost respect during this smear, how has he not, bk?

warren deserves zero respect for this nonsense. 

im telling you, she struck a deal w/ biden. hoping he gets the nom, and tossing her on will make bernie's base happy and show up. 

shit backfired. that ticket would lose votes, demotivate, and give trump the electoral again and the popular. 

you think is shes to get the nom. (literally 0% chance lol), bernie's base vote for her? fuck no. her campaign is a mess. 

cringe worthy liz, straight up triggered:

https://twitter.com/phil_lewis_/status/1217620878533496833?s=21

"i just wanna say HI Bernie" bwahahahahahha 

good job, bluest. keep going man. 

your comment about 2016 still makes you a dumb fuck. 

Mmmkay.

Sanders -> Trump voters…
WI: 51k
MI: 47k
PA: 116k

Trump win margin…
WI: 22k
MI: 10k
PA: 44k

keep going buddy. 

that video shows bernie's class, once again. and it shows warren's baiting, attempt at least, and complete lack of class.

it's like the HRC campaign all over again. so desperate.

when does warren make her hot sauce comment? after iowa and NH?

Yeah good stuff - puke. This is one of those defining moments of the campaign. Now no Warren voter will ever vote for Bernie and vice versa. Split that vote dems, hand it to trump. Dems are dumber than bry, thommy n slack combined.

All this episode shows is that the dems are too fucking stupid to get out of the way of a moving train. They're gonna sit on the tracks arguing and get obliterated by trump. If the dems had half the cunning focus of pubs, they'd never lose an election. But as it is, they'll never win.

>>Bernie has showed the utmost respect during this smear, how has he not, bk?

I don't like how he handled it during the debate. However, after hearing the post-debate exchange, I can clearly see that Warren can go fuck herself. What an asshole move. Throw out some accusation, and when it's denied pull the, "you're calling me a liar on national TV" card? Total trash.

>>>>Dems are dumber than bry, thommy n slack combined.

You're a Democrat. I'm not.

^ revelation not necessary, your dumbness is legendary round here

You don't provide proof. 

<<<>>>All this episode shows is that the dems are too fucking stupid to get out of the way of a moving train. They're gonna sit on the tracks arguing and get obliterated by trump. If the dems had half the cunning focus of pubs, they'd never lose an election. But as it is, they'll never win.

b/c corporate media and establishment dems. they're destroying our country and handing it over to the GOP. 

the political movement crushes trump. 

nothing else does. 

bernie raises over 4mil is the past two days since warren has started lying about bernie -- over 25k new donors, over 200k total. 2 days. 

people are ready, more than ever, to push bernie in there. dems. independents. republicans. 

<<<>>>I don't like how he handled it during the debate. However, after hearing the post-debate exchange, I can clearly see that Warren can go fuck herself. What an asshole move. Throw out some accusation, and when it's denied pull the, "you're calling me a liar on national TV" card? Total trash.

agreed. 

New Febreeze flavor?

However, after hearing the post-debate exchange, I can clearly see that Warren can go fuck herself. What an asshole move. Throw out some accusation, and when it's denied pull the, "you're calling me a liar on national TV" card? Total trash.

she was 100% aware that exchange would be picked up by the mics.  i wonder what cabinet position biden has offered to her.

"she was 100% aware that exchange would be picked up by the mics.  i wonder what cabinet position biden has offered to her."

Agreed. I couldn't really believe that she would be behind something like this, it seemed beyond her. But then that interaction on the stage was so contrived, so obvious, it's hard not to see it as anything but a political ploy.

^^VP no doubt. 

centrist liz -- thing is, she ain't half the politician obama was, so she's fooling nobody pretending to be a progressive. 

warren = done. 

never forget:

https://twitter.com/organizingpower/status/1217129097245155328?s=12

never forget 

lying liz always been a liar. 

safe to say the pregnancy story is a lie as well. 

and she just voted for trump's new trade deal. 

of course, bernie did not. 

crazy. 

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2020/01/elizabeth-warren-re...

yeah, like 'ol hill-dog, i don't trust anyone who "used to be" a conservative....take a hike.

"well into the ’80s Warren was espousing the views of an ascendant conservative legal movement that championed free markets over the intervention of government regulation"

when warren was a republican in 1991, bernie took over a GOP held seat and started fighting for M4A. 

these two people aren't the same. not even close. 

Not a huge fan of Warren in general, but the fact is that people can change. Her record has been pretty good.

At this point, ogkb, continuing all that Native American crap is pretty lame. Bernie people don't need to smear her like that, and if she wins the nomination I'd hope that they wouldn't do to her the same thing they did to Hillary. That will surely hand Trump the election. The  rhetoric and vitriol you posted is unnecessary and harmful.

"weed-scented" apartments <<<< Awesome ! all over america Charge In Your Own Life/s and make some friends along the way ~ simple

humboldt columbian cookies IS awesome my friend gave me a free sample 

yew

Bk waving a shamey finger in a POLITICS thread. 

LofuckinL.

also, thod remains among the most twisted of the curved spine ‘krewe’.  fucking guy is like the king of slow-bus island or whatever the setting of Where the Wild Things Are lol

not sure if pyramidheat meant to, but that was some ultra bernie bro misogyny to a tee. the warren vs bernie war is beginning to brew!

on another note, TOD, i am sorry but i can't associate myself with you anymore. email me offline if you'd like answers. 

Lol at the kid who spends all his time here waving the shamey finger and adding zero content.

Were you incessantly picked on in school? Lofuckinl 

Dont get too jelly, bk. 

You know I know youve also got not a one straight backbone. 

Its just that thod represents the sentiment so much more archetypically. Dont be sad, ol’ chap. 

Words and words

>>>Racket has been paying 40% tax for literally nothing his whole life (until 55 or whatever age you can collect Medicare and SS) but paying 50% for benefits that can help you right now as far as an education and in the future when you will absolutely need medical coverage is insanity right? 

Thats the shit right there.  Let’s give the government more money, because they manage what they already receive so well.  Ya know because the post office, the VA, social security, public schools, Amtrak, etc... are run so efficiently.  Hahaha.  I love these threads, pure comedy watching a bunch of burnouts like Turtle, heater, and slacker thinking government is going to save them.

racket has shit on his face from spewing it all day. typical. go clean up little buddy. 

jr and bk --nope. these are just facts, and have been available for years. 

democracy now did a piece on this last year, pretty wild and overall just fucking strange warren even attempted to say she was native american. lol. psychotic. 

point is she's a liar. always has been.

post debate warren drops 3 points nationally. 

17days until iowa. bernie is the man to beat. 

RealClear Politics is still showing  Biden up by 8 as an average of the polls. His numbers are dropping though, and  Bernie's are rising.

Watch out for Bloomberg. He's moving fast.

>>>>thinking government is going to save them.

We're saving you from the government. 

yeah we should all live in a libertarian dream world similar to....what's that country?

oh, nowhere...

Why is Racket on your jock, Turtle?

< Whats that country ?

not sure why the boner 4...

"Let’s give the government more money, because they manage what they already receive so well."

See, that's the thing: I've thought about this a lot and ultimately the only choice we have, the only option for a peaceful healthy tomorrow, is to trust our governments. We have to constantly work to strengthen democratic institutions and not fall into the trap of thinking that somehow the private sector can do it better. In some cases it can, but in ALL cases the cost is way too high, and I'm not talking about just money spent vs product earned.

Chile is the exemplar on a global scale of what happens when you privatize the shit out of everything. Every single service and product and industry is run by private companies. The result is massive inequality, an incredibly shitty education system and a 1% who basically showers in money every day because they don't know what to do with so much money. Plus, the environment gets destroyed along with vulnerable communities, government just becomes a porous rotating door between business people and politicians trading positions in government and lobbies and so on so forth. Privatization does not work. End of story. Time and time again humanity has demonstrated that it is far too corrupt to operate without oversight, and in a democracy oversight and accountability are fundamental for progress.

In short then, despite all it's flaws and all it's drawbacks, the only way forward is to invest in government and the shoring up of government institutions against potential corruption. It's more of a platonic ideal than a reality, necessarily. It's something to always strive for. There will always be cracks and the corrupt who look to scheme their way through it, and at those times we have to see how they did it, and plug up those leaks and loopholes.

Stop the privatization of the world, folks. It's a predictable and dead-end street. You all are some lucky motherfuckers (as is the world) to have a candidate like Sanders doing his thing right now... 

>>> You all are some lucky motherfuckers (as is the world) to have a candidate like Sanders doing his thing right now... <<<

Yeah crazy isn't? 

This guy appears to like him also, just look at him go to bat for ol' bern

>> Ya know because the post office, the VA, social security, public schools, Amtrak, etc... are run so efficiently.  Hahaha. <<

That right there is the rub. Those agencies wouldn't exist if reliant upon the private sector to provide them. They're doomed financially from the start and require public funding (get it?). What private company would provide health care to old, poor veterans? What private company would drive mail to Edna in East Bumfuckistan. Hell, toss in public transportation and public art for that matter. They are investments, dumbshit.

If the gravystains of the world continue to (selectively) red line publicly funded programs, we're doomed as a society. But, of course, increase the defense budget (and the revenue for Northrop, etc). What ever happened to the Great Society?

And what about public education? I mean, the United States has (from what I can find on the internet) one of the top educational systems on the planet. That's a pretty nice thing there. Plus, there's tons of state universities with cheap tuition. Yes, there's tons more work to be done on the education in the US, but it's not going to be the private sector that makes sure that vulnerable minority impoverished youth get an education.

some people think that trump university is the way i guess....

Turtle, the man-dem Hillary voter shits gotta stop.

I voted for bernie last primary, then Hillary in the general.

I live in NC and voted against trump, not because of the love of the candidate, it was the right fucking

thing to do.

We clear?

And no P-nutz, I will not hold my country back because I will vote blue no matter who, so fuck you.

bernie pulling away in NH. 

you know what's gonna be great -- seeing obama having to endorse bernie sanders once he wins the dem nom. 

thod calm down you little bitch. vote blue no matter who lol. good. get ready to vote bernie again -- anything but in the primary is a vote for trump as bernie is by far the most electable. not even close. 

thod twitter is not good for you man. foaming at the mouth. 

then stop bashing him and get behind the mule.

after the primary...i voted for hil-dawg too...we clear?

>> you know what's gonna be great -- seeing obama having to endorse bernie sanders once he wins the dem nom.  <<

Why, because you think it will make him squirm, or because you will celebrate the party coming together? I'd guess the former.

why? lol. b/c he'll fucking hate it and he'll have to do it. 

Yea, that's what I thought. Unifier the Not.

you're just upset bernie is going to win. grow up, mr undecided. 

You're just as bad as Trump and his cultists. lol

I'm getting the distinct feeling that a whole bunch of Bernie supporters will not vote for a ticket that has Warren as president or VP, and regardless of what they say now, they also won't vote for Biden, Bloomberg, or Pete. Unless Bernie wins the nomination, they are staying home.

i do not think that bk.

lol ned. good stuff man. 

remember, obama has been knowingly working behind the scenes to sink bernie. a little sweet justice then move on is acceptable. jesus. like i said, grow up. 

We'll see. I sure hope not. The level of vitriol from the Bernie people is definitely ramping up. 

warren has no shot at becoming the dem nominee. 0% chance. 

it'll be biden or bernie. imo. 

BK is right. No way in hell 'heater is getting of his couch to vote for anyone but Bernie.

>>>obama has been knowingly working behind the scenes to sink bernie

Factual sources?

i already said i would ned. 

remember when you said i'd prevent you from voting bernie. that was funny. 

I don't believe you based on your posts here. There is no way you would vote for a Biden/Warren ticket.

the website is www.google.com BK....

https://www.commondreams.org/news/2019/11/26/obama-privately-considered-...

https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2019/11/26/barack-obama-2020-demo...

Hmm, in 2016 a lot of Bernie supporters said they'd vote for Hillary. Many stayed at home, and a whole bunch voted for Trump.

What people say isn't always what they do.

>>>>>I live in NC

I live in California. It's as blue as racket. He isn't voting for Bernie. 

>and a whole bunch voted for Trump.<

sources?

This is quite a bit more factual than either of the opinion pieces you posted: https://www.npr.org/2017/08/24/545812242/1-in-10-sanders-primary-voters-...

This is quite a bit more factual than either of the opinion pieces you posted: https://www.npr.org/2017/08/24/545812242/1-in-10-sanders-primary-voters-...

>> why? lol. b/c he'll fucking hate it and he'll have to do it.  <<

Proof positive.

Why not say: I look forward to Obama and the Dems and the neds of the world to embrace Bernie's platform so we can, together, remove trump from office.

Nope, it's: I want to see Obama  squirm.

Yuck. You're telling me to grow up? lofl.

remember when you said that, ned? shits crazy. 

more bernie supporters voted for HRC than hrc supporters for obama. fact. 

and bernie did 40 events for hrc. 

hrc did 12 for obama. 

I remember reading the same agro-hippie bernie-bro crap, yes.

So to surmise pyramid; it was HRC and Obama who scuttled Bernie in 16 with their unscrupulous democratic ways. OMG lmao that's too fucking hilarious for words. You think those two did Bernie in, wait till you see what trump'll do to him. 

BK there's tons of articles. I listed the 1st 2....

To me, your article proves that Bernie has appeal to conservative and on the fence voters...

Okay, spin it however you want to spin it.

I like chocolate ice cream. They were out of chocolate, so I ordered a cone of shit, which is the same color.

Is that how it worked, Turts? 

https://twitter.com/nytopinion/status/1217579480652357632

the republicans and democrats have failed us. 

Both Bernie and Trump appealed to the "we need something different " people. Their policies were diametrically opposed. Bernie's policies are appealing to no conservatives. He's a friggin' Socailist.

ras wtf are you even saying? lol. 

bk you're not paying attention. 

ned too ashamed to remember lol. 

Paying attention to what? I know Bernie's policies very well. They are opposed to conservative policies.

hey it's not so black and white haha! 

Moderates don't think blue states have issues. 

Believe what you need to believe, Turts and ogkb. If you truly think that real conservatives are behind Bernie, have at it.

From the poll I posted, I'd gather that a whole bunch of people wanted an outsider. Bernie was preferred, but they want for the next option, Trump.

look, there's people that were pro bernie that actually voted trump, pulled the trigger n all. stupid. but those are the people that bernie will win if he's the nominee -- wisconsin, michigan, pa, even FL. shits crazy -- that a centrist will not win. 

in addition, the large swath of independents favor bernie, and won't vote corporate dem. just like certain republicans that are disgusted w/ trump but will also never vote corporate dem over trump. 

this is why biden is a terrible choice. this is why hrc was a terrible choice, and why the fake populist won. 

the dems abandoned us. the gop have lost their fucking minds, in addition to never giving a fuck about us. 

It will be interesting to see who steps up to take Bernie's Senate seat, in either 21 or 24. I can't see Leahy doing another term, either. Within the next 4 years, the Vermont contingent in Senate is going to be very different.

<<<>>>

Why not say: I look forward to Obama and the Dems and the neds of the world to embrace Bernie's platform so we can, together, remove trump from office.

Nope, it's: I want to see Obama  squirm.

Yuck. You're telling me to grow up? lofl.

<<<>>>> 

come on, try just a little. 

the movement embraces everybody -- that's what it's about. why you been fighting it so hard? 

if you have a problem w/ me taking a little joy in king centrist obama having to endorse bernie, i don't know what to tell you man. grow up. that's it. grow the fuck up. put on your big boy pants, and join the movement. as has been reported, fact, obama has been working to sink bernie, just like all centrists. 

so when bernie supporters clap back just a little, we are demons. it's just how it is, it's how the corporate media have molded the thought process. we've seen it evolve over the past 4 years. indisputable. 

agreed, bk. 

i can see zuckerman trying for it after he loses the governor's race, then losing that sentate race as well. 

idk. 

Zuckerman is a genuinely nice guy. Maybe he can beat Scott, who in Alabama would be considered a Commie.

nobody in the farming community respects zuckerman. he's very disliked. 

ive also been told about certain "me too" type accusations from female farm workers. 

All 13 farmers left in the state?

haha yup. 

Yea, you got it all wrong (again). Me voting for Bernie in the general wouldn't be me 'joining the movement', it would be voting for the only option to oust Trump.

If you ended up voting for Biden/Warren in the general would you be joining that 'movement'? No.

>> so when bernie supporters clap back just a little, we are demons. it's just how it is, it's how the corporate media have molded the thought process. <<

No, it's childish and lacking perspective. Blaming the corporate media for you childish reaction is, well, even more childish. But, I should grow up, right?

>They were out of chocolate, so I ordered a cone of shit, which is the same color.

Is that how it worked, Turts? <

what does that mean? i'm not sophisticated enough to get it....

you don't understand shit, ned. biden has no movement. warren has no movement. just making it to the general isnt a movement. just running in this shit show isn't a movement. yeah, grow up. start paying attention. 

ned fighting to hold the country back. sad. 

ned is a bloomberg dude.

You inability to consider a different point of view is stunning.

different point of view -- thats hilarious man. 

the different point of view is bernie -- who happens to have the best chance to beat the monster trump that we all hate. 

we've tried the centrist way, and they all lost -- except obama, but he ran on progressive ideals and then quickly abandoned them, like, immediately. part of the reason why trump the fake populist is president. he's a result of the republican and democrat establishment's abandonment and failures representing the working class over the past 60 years. 

but obama was able to turn our the vote, motivate new voters, get young people engaged, organize -- which is what bernie has been and is doing, which is why this campaign has been so successful up to this point, and launched him to the front of the pack. 

>>> in 2016 a lot of Bernie supporters said they'd vote for Hillary. Many stayed at home, and a whole bunch voted for Trump. <<<
 

Exactly...

How about some real talk for a minute? No cultist bullshit.

Here's some math on bernie voters in the primary who voted for trump in the general.

I don't think this should be taken lightly and hopefully you won't either.

as i stated, those numbers show he has cross over appeal to conservatives/moderates/independents and people that want to smash the system.

too bad hill-dawg ignored or took for granted those states...

>>what does that mean? i'm not sophisticated enough to get it....

Lol, it made sense to me at the time. How about if we let it slide, because I'm not sophisticated enough to understand what the fuck I was getting at. It was a good point, though.

thod just doesn't understand. 

just vote bernie if you hate trump, thod. respond YES if you understand. 

Which real republicans is he appealing to? The socialist, pro-choice, free college republicans? 

Thod is doing his best to flip California from blue to blue. 

Moderates want progressives to settle in and enjoy the economy. It's booming.

the working class republicans/independents that want healthcare, billionaires and corporations to pay taxes, livable wages, better paying jobs -- those republicans. 

All 13 of those Republicans?

why did hrc lose wisconsin pa michigan? 

>>>>>the working class republicans/independents that want healthcare, billionaires and corporations to pay taxes, livable wages, better paying jobs -- those republicans

College educated moderates call those people deplorable. 

I think that there are 100 factors that went in to her loss in those states.

1. hubris

2. sanders supporters voting for Trump

3. the far right smear campaign that was propagated by the far left

4. hubris

5. low voter turnout

6 - 100. all sorts of shit

I laugh at the centrists in progressives wool squirming so hard in here. 

Good fuckin show Ras, nedb, Bk et. al. Glorious. 

Special particupation trophies all around. Esp. Raz. That ones got a very special round head. 

are we taking notes, bk? 

maybe do another deep allegory lol!

Just stop the excuses/blame so we can move on...

222,332 bernie voters voted for trump.

Trump wins all 3 states by 77,744

because hillary didn't go to those states??

Do you realize that bernie voters gave trump the win?
 

I know it's hard to believe, because you hate trump, but the numbers don't lie.

Is it that hard to grasp?

- question king

Ateix, are you a progressive? You seem to have that deep sense of caring for your fellow man.

>>>>>Sanders supporters voting for Trump

She won by millions but lost by thousands. Her base did not participate 100%. More of her voters probably stayed home because she was running against a grifter that didn't have her brain. 

thod you're just a dumb mother fucker. you don't even deserve a response. 

yeah, fuck math, right kids?
 

Super delegates can fix math.

Lol arguing about individual votes.

Actually, the numbers say trump lost.

it's difficult for centrists to understand how the most qualified candidate in modern history, lol, lost to the least qualified candidate in modern history. 

she lost b/c she never embraced the working class movement bernie was pushing onto the country, that the country was (is) screaming for. 

is hubris your way of saying HRC ran an absolutely horrible campaign, assuming she'd beat trump the reality tv star who had zero prior political experience, not having to campaign and organize at a state level, connecting w/ the electorate, showing them that she understands their worries and issues? relating to the average person on a human level, and not come off as an elite and privileged robot that is only running to solidly her legacy and sell more books eventually? totally out of touch, it's her fault she couldn't get people to vote for her. she took for granted the position she was in. 

and then, finally, after vilifying bernie for 12 months, she picks kaine as vp -- solidifying what everybody had already thought, she wasn't going to DC to fight for the average american or change the status quo. she's going to fight to keep centrists in power, to fight for her corporate friends, fight for fossil fuel companies to continue destroying our land, etc. 

No Bss, If those 222,332 bernie voters had voted for clinton in the general, trump would've lost the election, his margin of victory was only 77,744.

For all 3 states.

>>> Lol arguing about individual votes. <<<

Regardless, the math proves on this point alone that bernie voters handed trump his presidency.

So vote for anybody your heart desires in the primary...

but remember those numbers and if you don't get out and vote blue,

you're handing him another presidency.

That's simple math.

thod you're a troll who can't think for himself. haha. 

you need a math tutor kid, I'm here for ya.

I think that we need to draw some distinctions between the types of Bernie voters in 2016.

 There were those who were behind Bernie because they agreed with his policies. I'd venture to guess that very, very few of this group voted for Trump. If they didn't vote for Hillary, they sat it out.

Then there were the ones who were for him because he was an outsider, different. They didn't care about policy or platform, just his status. These are the ones who voted for Trump. They were never behind his policies, just his persona.

I like you bk.