Victim or the Crime

Never ever dug it.

I witnessed the first time it was every attempted (acoustically) at a December '87 AIDS benefit at the Warfield (w Joan Baez).

More to the point:
“Victim” debuted on June 17, 1988, at the Metropolitan Sports Center in Bloomington, Minnesota. It remained in the rotation thereafter, and was played for the final time on July 2, 1995 at Deer Creek Music Center in Noblesville, Indiana. It was released on Built to Last on October 31, 1989.

JG: I think the first time Weir showed it ["Victim or the Crime"] to me was when we played with Joan Baez at an AIDS thing in the city, and he -- I listened in amazement and said "God, that's got pretty angular changes, doesn't it?" It's fascinating because it defies, almost, any effort to play freely through it. You have to know it; it's that simple. It has changes in it, and they're very strict, and they have lots of real dissonant moments. So the angularity of it was fascinating to me, the tonality was, because it's one of those things where you really have to stretch to figure out something appropriate to play to add to the tonal mood of the tune.

http://www.dead.net/features/greatest-stories-ever-told/greatest-stories...

Here's that very first attempt by Weir, Garcia and Kahn courtesy of Loloyodel:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c_6lG8l8TbA

Trippy fucking song. Jerry liked it.

More from Garcia on VOTC:
"The text of it -- I don't believe I've ever actually listened to all the words to it. Ever. I have the gist of it; by now I probably could recite it if I really had to, but the text of it is more of the same in a way, it doesn't have a whole lot of light in it. It's very dense, and it's angst-ridden to boot. So it seemed to me when we were starting to record it, in order to save it from an effort to make it more attractive, I thought that what would work with the song would be to just go with it, to go with the angularity and the sort of asymmetrical way it's structured, and play to expose that. An early possibility that occurred to me was that this would be an interesting song to do something really strange with. And this is where of course Mickey comes into the picture, 'cause he's one of the guys that holds down the strangeness corner and he's always a willing accomplice in these ideas. So I thought the Beam, which is an instrument that people feel about about the way they feel about Victim or the Crime, the tune – I thought, let's take two of the things that really have a huge potential for really upsetting people --

BS: A polarization tool.

JG: Absolutely -- and let's combine them in a happy marriage, something that will be a real horror show. And it's turned out to be strangely beautiful. I really enjoy it, now. When me and Mickey started working on it, I'd be sitting there listening and say "You know, I may be going crazy, but I'm starting to like this...""

Soundtrack to a bad trip

I heard a beautiful Victim->Foolish to close Set 1 at my first Grateful Dead show; the Victim was so trippy and full of strange MIDI sounds and I just fell in love with it. I'd never heard a live band do anything so out there before--it stuck in my head as much as anything from that day. Just when they had you out there floating through deep space without a tether, they reeled you back in with that Foolish melody...man, was I hooked on these guys after that day. Great versions of Blow Away, and The Weight at this show, too.

https://archive.org/details/gd90-05-06.sbd.wiley.11661.sbeok.shnf/gd90-0...

I like it.  Enough of that ring around the rosie shit.

I enjoy the Weir/Wasserman ones a lot.  There's a decent one here where the rest of the band leaves and it's just Bob and Rob.

https://archive.org/details/ratdog1997-12-13.flac16/ratdog1997-12-13d1t1...

I'm glad most of the GD catalog wasn't like that, but I dig it. Interesting chord changes.

It's a better song than Layla. 

What fixation feeds this fever?

As the full moon pales and climbs

Am I living truth or rank deceiver?

 Am I the victim or the crime?…

The 1st time I heard / saw Victim or the crime was 4 -26 -85 played by Weir at Fenders Ballroom in Long Beach Calif.with Kingfish

The first time I saw Sublime was at Fenders in Long Beach.

Suburban Rhythm and Joker Pickle's Reaction opened. 

New years 89-90 comes to mind. 

I

i was at that 5-6-90 gig at Cal State dominguez hills...weird tune, very dark and ominous. hard to smile during it.

Saw one solo acoustic when Bobby was featured with Kingfish, double bill with Zero...

3/3/86 Pulsations, Glen Mills, PA. An old disco about 30 mins west of Philly...

Patience runs out on the bunny

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HvOvvNDC428

Never liked it

I used to not like it but it's one of the most exploratory songs of the last 5 years and there is some real interesting music in there.   When I was listening to every show I have from start to finish, that was where the music was most creative in that time frame.   It can get raw and explosive.   

I think it's one of their most underrated songs. A lot of people hate it. It's poignant with dark, mysterious imagery. It's relatable and timeless as most people have been affected by addiction struggles in one way or another. 

http://tubtut.info/onlain/besplatnoaHQtZXlpZmxYYW8

^hey mr f, i am enjoying all the gd videos on this site.

what language is that on the website?  thanks

Deer Creek 89, I could have sworn that Bobby sang, "These are the haunts of Indiana..."<<

MSG "Revolution" (82 or 83):  My buddy swore Bobby sang "When you go dealin' with people like Watt and Haig . . "

I think it's some kind of programming language.

Blast that Victim as loud as you can take it.

>>I think it's some kind of programming language.

yes. the computer in Trump's head is programmed in that language.

I'll admit I didn't like it at first. Saw it too much. Completely changed my mind after RFK 7-12-90. Just a sick version IMO.  The Phil bombs & kinda dark leads by Jerry made for a great version. 

From the official release Victim starts @ 7:28 but the beautiful Box of Rain is certainly worth a listen

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=B_vjNIKy51A 

More truth in this song than most people can handle.

More truth in this song than most people can handle.

lol.

great song, love it. 

Beast, I peed a little when I read that too

Somewhere I read an interview or something w/Barlow, who mentioned that "some" of the Dead organization at the time, didn't think it would be OK to sing lyrics that contained the j-word, with the J-man standing right there onstage in full view.

Turned out to be a non-issue, Jerry was like, unfazed. (And probably in denial anyhow, although I don't know that for sure.)

It's definitely the most unique-sounding GD song.

I saw the Met Center Bloomington one on a head full of Escher and it got weird AF! Especially during halftime after it...

Inspired by this thread, I just purchased JGB/Bob&Rob - Fall 1989: The LI Sound. (Even though I didn't have good time at the show)

>>>Somewhere I read an interview or something w/Barlow, who mentioned that "some" of the Dead organization at the time, didn't think it would be OK to sing lyrics that contained the j-word, with the J-man standing right there onstage in full view.

Didn't know Barlow said that.  He had nothing to do with the song, I'm guessing you know.

Brent had a big problem with it and voiced his opinions to the band.

Apparently, that was why Weir used the 'bunny' line for one show.

>>Inspired by this thread, I just purchased JGB/Bob&Rob - Fall 1989: The LI Sound. (Even though I didn't have good time at the show)

The vocals on some of the JGB discs on this release break up like the gain was too high somewhere in the signal path and crushed the level.  A lot of good playing but that vocal issue bugs me for an official release

Yeah...the sound on that release was really for shit.

The Bob/Rob boards sounded fine. 

Never really liked it that much, but thought it was funny when bobby dedicated it to the NFL at that furthur show in Seattle...

This is my current favorite by Accident of Birth:

https://youtu.be/u6kWiIHgqrw

Count me as one who grew to love it. That tune was a like a breeze of air running through a scary basement. It was dark, moody and evoked emotion.. And that was just the music. I love hearing Jerry describe it as dense and angular. So right on.  What a smart man.  To me it always seemed like Jerry was kept on his toes when they played it. Like he was showing respect for it. I get chills when a good version comes on. 

"what fixation feeds this fevah?"