In Case Someone Here Lost It

The narwhals seem a little jumpy today.

just legalize everything...

probably a few new shallow holes dug somewhere

They're trying legalizing everything right now in the PNW.  It's led to a bunch of zombies openly smoking fetanyl in the streets and shooting up on public transit.  It's bad for public health, public safety, and families, and is a troubling sign of a diseased society.  I'm okay with people medicating whatever they want as long as they aren't imposing on others.  People smoking fetanyl at the bus stops and shooting up on the light rail is an imposition.

It's probably worse @ PNW but we have that spectacle going on in LA too, even without any widespread push for drug legalization

> a troubling sign of a diseased society

And perhaps by legalizing drug use, and/or choosing not to prosecute it, a light is shone on the troubling signs and steps are finally taken to rectify the causes of these problems, rather than leaving them to fester in the shadows.

The cynic in me makes me wonder if it's some nefarious strategy to kill off the drug addicted mentally ill homeless population instead of creating holistic strategies to strengthen well being for all.  So many are dying from overdoses that the average life expectancy has had a noticeable drop.

Fentanyl doesnt come from here, it isn't manufactured here. It comes from china in the form of various chemical inputs (totally legal there), thru mexico, where it is manufactured and smuggled in.

And the public health crisis that it has caused is totally horriffic.

I maintain that drug users aren't criminals and shouldn't be prosecuted unless their drug consumption directly harms non-willing participants. I still think a head change is still a basic human right.

Seeing people smoke fent or whatever on the street is not my cup of tea, but that's where most of them also live, so yeah. Homelessness will continue to increase as housing becomes more and more unaffordable. This is the new normal in the United States of America. We wanted capitalism, we got it. I'm sorry people will have to find a way to explain these realities to their kids.

I just spent the weekend in the tenderloin. Worst I've seen yet. WAY worse than anything I have seen in the PNW. (Okay I haven't gone everywhere in the NW, but I do get around).

meanwhile, the privileged have the luxury of smoking pills on their couch and then going for a drive. A diseased society? Most definitely.

We can maintain legal substance abuse while still maintaining an "off with their heads" approach to trafficking/smuggling of specific materials. Both things can be true together.

Unfortunately we need to have a coherent national dialogue about actually securing our borders. I don't think the party in charge has the fortitude and I think the other guys solution to just criminalize everybody for every reason is also a non-starter.

The vast majority of all smuggled-in narcotics pass through legal ports of entry in vehicles so the open border argument is weak at best

it's not weak. i can smuggle pretty much anything i need coming in from mexico in my truck. most people can.

the reason as you note is because our borders are quite obviously porous, and insecure

like i said

The Wall is oft-cited as a solution. Does your plan more thoroughly check every vehicle, completely stopping all commerce and other travel at ports of entry? It's a real mess for sure but the cartels have largely just swept in where Big Pharma left off with their loose and over-prescribing of opioids, with more infrastructure in the areas with the greatest "need" (addiction rates) all while picking up new customers all the while. Keeping people away from opioids seems to be proving more difficult overall.

The U.S. at large can't seem to do two somewhat contrary things at once (targeting smugglers while giving users/addicts a pass), unless there is a big payday/payoff. Look at some states that supposedly have "legal" weed yet home-growing is banned (IL & WA come to mind). Money Honey.

LOL my plan? the wall? Like there's a 100% complete solution? I'm not running for politics, but since you asked some version of those things would probably be a part of it

treating cartels as a military adversary would be another part of it  (are they not a direct treat to our national health? well being? security? safety?)

if that means a militarized border, than I'm good with that. As long as the establishment of actual effective and efficient pathways to immmigration and political refuge are also addressed simultaneously.

cutting back on trade with hostile adversaries (buying a LOT less shit from china) would probably be another big part of it. That's a gut check.

yeah, Americans aren't gonna stop using opioids. That's why it's a hell of a lot easier to control activity at ports of entry than to attempt to control 300-odd million americans' drug appetites

people who think actual physical border security is some kind of political football game where the only real purpose is to just keep moving the golalposts around will say "sorry but that just isn't possible"

well then that's that.

> Americans aren't gonna stop using opioids

No, but demand can be reduced, and if that should ever happen in a big way, the cartels would have to figure out a new way to make their bloody money. Either that, or move up north, become citizens, and join the Republican party.

But they have already 'moved north' and freely operate in every U.S. community. Their successful  logistics endeavors put Amazon to shame.

A bit off topic but one of the comments to this article was worth sharing:

New York firm closes pot shops in Pueblo, blames lack of enforcement of the black market:

https://www.yahoo.com/news/curaleaf-close-5-pueblo-county-222932613.html

comment:

I love that the corporate talking head basically says that his profits are down because people don't want to pay inflated prices at dispensaries so they buy from "illicit" dealers, and blames cops for not doing enough to keep him rich by busting said dealers. Just funny how the whole "freedom to choose what goes into your body" movement turned into cop-loving oppressors when their bottom line began to suffer.

And no, this isn't an indictment of capitalism, far from it. The marriage of the state and corporations in this manner is more accurately known as economic fascism. The sale between the small closet grower and a customer seeking a better price and/or quality is the true free market (i.e., capitalist) transaction.

That's the one we should all fully support if you genuinely believe in the freedom to choose what you consume and with whom you spend your money. Being forced by law to buy from a store that the state collects taxes from is nothing more than an alternate form of the same oppression that existed while this plant was illegal.

Do as you will, but I'd always rather save money buying from a trusted friend instead of enriching some corporate board and the state that thinks they can control my actions and strip me of my ability to voluntarily associate with whom I choose.

They're trying legalizing everything right now in the PNW.  It's led to a bunch of zombies openly smoking fetanyl in the streets and shooting up on public transit.  It's bad for public health, public safety, and families, and is a troubling sign of a diseased society.  I'm okay with people medicating whatever they want as long as they aren't imposing on others.  People smoking fetanyl at the bus stops and shooting up on the light rail is an imposition.<<<

If they neither break your leg nor pick your pocket, where's the imposition?

This is not to say that fentanyl isn't a huge problem.

In my estimation, what's an even bigger problem than fentanyl is the growing number of OD's by those who might be seeking non-opiate drugs but who've inadvertently consumed a lethal dose of a "product" that was either cut or contaminated with fentanyl.   All powders fall into this category.  It's also possible that doses are now being cut with it.

589 lbs meth this past August......just one vehicle, one stop.

https://kfor.com/news/local/investigation-leads-to-one-of-largest-meth-b...

it's been over for a long time, decades. Legalize everything....now.  The war on drugs has never been anything more than a war on poor people, and mostly poor people of color.  

The bottom line is that we really don't give a shit about mental health care in this country unless billions can be earned (that ultra-important ROI for those ultra-important shareholders) on a new drug.

so, most likely for the foreseeable future, we'll all have to expect feeling a bit uncomfortable watching addicts try to survive their day. 

Ironically enough, another Schedule 1,  5-Meo Dmt, is being researched as one of the most effective addiction busters ever used in therapy. 

https://www.lucid.news/companies-embrace-5-meo-dmt-therapies/

Where's the imposition?

LOL.

I've seen junkies shooting up on the light rail right in front of groups of tourists headed to the airport after disembarking from their cruise ships.  The families looked uncomfortable, as their more fit members moved to get inbetween the zombies and the children and more senior members of their group.  These same asshats also verbally threatened some poor homeless lady who  was blocking their exit, pushed her out of the way, and kicked her iced-coffee beverage over.  I'm sure they all went home with glowing feel-good stories about their visit to Seattle to share with their friends and families.

I've been notified by customers of mine who had to circumnavigate some folks smoking fentanyl and/or crack at the top of the stairway down to my store, and didn't feel comfortable about it.  About a month ago, after one of these instances, I went up to street level to see what was going on, and ran into a guy sitting against the wall on the sidewalk just outside our entrance, and some lady he was with who was all jittery and bugging out.  I took a deep breath and calmly said something along the lines of "I know you all just want to get high, but could you take it somewhere else.  This is a business entrance, and you're making my customers uncomfortable."  The dude said, "I'm just  enjoying my drink," while gesturing at his soft drink.  He was cool as a cucumber.  I said, "well, that's okay, but my customers told me they saw you using drugs".  He was in the middle of denying it, when his wigged out friend broke out her crack pipe and started firing up right then.  I looked at him and said, "See, could you please just take it somewhere else?  I can always call the cops."  Dude looked at me and cooly said, "And what good would that do?"   Had to admit he had a point.   I just shrugged and said "if you could move, I would appreciate it."   Then for some reason, I added "You all just try to take care".  He smiled, got up and gestured to his friend that it was time to move along.  Anyway, it all resolved without escalating or bringing LEO into it, but it was still an imposition.

> we really don't give a shit about mental health care in this country

That's part of the problem, but as Bss noted above, homelessness is a factor too. We have a subclass of people in the US who don't get a seat at the table for one reason or another, but that's pretty much baked into our economic system at this point. A few years ago, I did an informal study of the poverty rate in the US during my lifetime, and found that about 10% of the population lives in poverty during good times and bad. What that tells me is that for our system to work, we need about 10% of the population to go hungry. There's an Ursula Le Guin story titled "The Ones Who Walk Away from Omelas" that illustrates this idea in a very chilling way.

Fentanyl is killing many, many people who know nothing about it, or even consciously do know and want nothing to do with it

That fentanyl is permeating the entire drug supply means it can't and shouldn't be treated the same as other (lesser?) drug trafficking

I know you all might think I'm usually soft on this sort of stuff, but I just don't think folks moving an ounce of fent should be treated any differently than people who abuse kids or shoot up shopping malls.

Should they?

and any junkie worth his salt will tell you its not even a good high anyways

i'm having trouble following. i agree most all drug use should be legal.i don't agree fentanyl fits into that box.

also agree that the government or non- profit or wheomever supplying drugs (depending on a lot of other things) can actually be harm reduction. we've got years to go before that is a viable american discussion.

No, I don't necessarily agree that the imaginary guy slamming on the subway should be policed up and sent to jail.

I'm also sorry to hear about your friend's mom doing hard time

choices

>>>Fentanyl doesnt come from here, it isn't manufactured here. It comes from china in the form of various chemical inputs (totally legal there), thru mexico, where it is manufactured and smuggled in.

a recent report on fentanyl...

 https://www.wired.com/story/fentanyl-ingredients-chinese-labs-cryptocurr...

Ew no thanks

Bad drugs are bad

i don't know what the solution is.

while i do think cartels are a total threat to humanity...prolly more so than some dudes in caves 1/2 way around the world...

how would attacking them even work? bombing targets in mexico seems like a bad idea.

our economic model requires a certain level of unemployment and poverty. see the current inflation trend...

the zombies on the streets are the by-product of this, exacerbated by the corporations and powers that be continuing to enrich themselves off of the backs of the working class. it's just increased to a unsustainable level. fuck, you can't even live by yourself these days under $100k. That's the new minimum wage...can't imagine why people give up and just get high. fuck it.

I don't know what the solution is, but if mental health for ALL is taken as seriously as many take the fucking stock markets, that would be a good place to start for finding a solution.

>>>Look at some states that supposedly have "legal" weed yet home-growing is banned(IL and WA come to mind).

I don't  know about WA and i haven't lived in IL for a few years, but I had my patient card when i lived there and was legally allowed to have 6 plants on my property. I took full advantage of that allowance.... and more :-) There was also a billboard on I-55 south letting cardholders know they could grow 6 plants at home.

Fully agree that it's time to legalize everything. It's the only way to make headways in the public health crisis.

Fentanyl is a strange one because not only is it deadly, it's being cut into every other drug. It makes no sense. I also think we're understating the Chinese government's role in flooding the US with that crap. Nothing happens over there without governmental approval, and even support. They are doing to us what the Brits did to them with Opium.

The Chinese economy is on the verge of collapse, they need trade with the US and EU, they are overextended on all the ports they've been buying and rebuilding around the world, yet they have us by the balls. It seems like we should be in the power position, but we sure as hell aren't.

Seattle's city council is voting this Tuesday on whether to make simple drug possession and public use a gross midemeanor:

https://www.theurbanist.org/2023/06/02/seattle-democrats-mulling-drug-la...
 

https://publicola.com/2023/06/02/moving-beyond-possession-and-public-use...