Coronavirus - what is really going on here?

Change the channel.

>>Are there larger forces at play here?<<

Like, larger than common sense?

The New World Order pushing buttons to weed out the poor, elderly, and poor AND elderly. Of course, the stupid, which there's a ton of.

Do Trump, Pence, Biden or Pelosi look like they're worried about that shit? 

Do you have loved ones that are risk?  It is not acceptable for a government to ignore a disease that could kill millions of its people.  

>> If 50,000 people die because of Corona, that only equals 1.67%.<<

If it remains that "low" it's because we're all quarantined. If we hadn't this thing would have washed through the population like a tsunami.

OP,  please realize the magnitude if zero actions were taken.

We will see how it turns out for Sweden, which instead of isolating most people, has gone for the "herd immunity" approach.  They are telling older folks to stay home though. 

There will be plenty of Monday morning quarterbacks when all is said and done.

Robert F. Kennedy's niece, who was fighting Bill Gates on vaccine policy, mysteriously ended up dying along with her boy in a "freak canoe accident". Obviously it's not hard to get two bodies dead from asphyxiation loaded onto a canoe and then tip the canoe over in deep water, but the BIG mystery is how both bodies sank to the bottom when dead women float breast up. So obviously Robert is pissed, and he is now letting it all out. See these quotes from Robert with regard to Bill Gates:
This was all said on April 8 2020:
Vaccines, for Bill Gates, are a strategic philanthropy that feed his many vaccine-related businesses (including Microsoft's ambition to control a global vac ID enterprise) and give him dictatorial control over global health policy - the spear tip of corporate neo-imperialism.

Gates' obsession with vaccines seems fueled by a messianic conviction that he is ordained to save the world with technology and a god-like willingness to experiment with the lives of "lesser humans."

We are already doing way better than Sweden. 

Deaths per 1M population.

US 75

Sweden 102

If Trump had run it his way we would be like Spain coming in at 386, but because of his delays we won't be like Canada at 22 or Germany at 39

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/ 

>>>The government and media stoked fear that hospitals will be overrun when in fact, many of them are laying off or furloughing staff.

Yes this is true and shows you how insane it is to run health care as for profit industry. In the midst of a massive medical emergency we cut staff and pay of health care workers because elective surgery was put off where hospitals make the most money. THAT DID NOT HAPPEN IN COUNTRIES WITH SOCIALIZED MEDICINE.

>>>Instead of applying a blanket policy to the majority of healthy Americans, wouldn't it have been more effective to laser-focus care and coverage for the at-risk demographic?

Yes again that was the South Korean model test every one and isolate those who are sick, but once again the failed Trump Administration turned down a test kit from WHO to develop their own that took months to work. Even today we are doing about 100k tests a day and we need to be doing a million a day

I lost a 1st cousin of mine from Palo Alto two weeks ago. Retired school teacher, 71, in good shape, suddenly developed all the symptoms of corona but because of the lack of testing,  she passed before it was verified. Her dr said sadly this is common. So you can multiply those death toll numbers, by how much, nobody's quite sure.

Once an extreme action works it’s viewed that it wasn’t necessary?

I will choose Gates, his computers and technology over Trump and his gut, next

Pence looks worried all the time.  Like he's gonna crack or accidently answer a question.

To see what is going on in the world, and then suggests that the economic loss outways the social distancing approach to saving lives, suggests that perhaps people who think that way need to change their strain. Conspiracy theorists aside, common sense is indeed something to consider.   

>>>>> or accidently answer a question.

Funniest thing I've read in along time.   Thanks for that.  

I would also like to add

l believe in the people working on the vaccine, I believe it will not take as long as expected, I believe in times like these there are still humans that rise to the challenges, and I used to believe that these people that discover this would be Americans. Not so sure about the last part but still fully believe the rest.

I've kept up a little bit with the folks I use to work with during my tenure in radiology...   while most of the nurses I know are centrist leaning liberal, they all want to hang Trump up by the balls for not only  his mishandling of this pandemic, but all the BS he's continued to spread since.  What's surprising, is how many of the conservative republicans are in extreme disgust over Trumps handling of things.  I thought i'd never see them rip the president, let alone vote for a democrat, but they've been ripping on their fellow party members to take this thing seriously, which has fallen upon (mostly) deaf ears.  

Within any state ..quarantine the hot spots ...keep those places shut/locked down but the governor should gradually open up the rest of the state starting in May. Imo

There is just too many people that are dying from this that simply would not have died from catching the seasonal flu. Two months ago i would have agreed with the original post but as we now see a young, healthy person can catch this and die. Where I live in the epicenter of this I know of or have friends who know of a number of younger people (under 40) and a few of people in their 20's who have died. No underlying conditions. That's just crazy. The fact that you can get this at that age and die a few weeks later is why we can't let up on this. A guy that one of my good friends work with just died this week. He's had it for weeks, was getting better, then took a turn for the worst. 34 years old. It's way too random right now in who is getting infected. I know of a guy who was 63 who died at home. He went to the hospital, they said he had it but didn't need to be admitted. He died at home in his sleep. I also know of a number of people in the older "high risk" group who have died.

It's not career bureaucrats 

The latest survey by Quinnipiac University found 81 percent of U.S. adults backed a national stay-at-home order, with 17 percent opposing the idea.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/why-doesnt-flu-tank-economy-like-covid-19-11586511000

The big unknown is how many people have already had the virus, got better, and didn't even know it.   Once widespread antibody testing is available, it will shed new light on those numbers.   Already, the British medical journal Lancet has reduced its estimation of mortality rates down to below 1% based on its estimation of the number of unreported, asymptomatic cases.  Cold comfort to all the dead, but it will help put everything into perspective once we finally get a handle on this and things calm down.   This will be the most closely studied pandemic in human history and will hopefully provide helpful guidance in dealing with the next inevitable (and perhaps, much more deadly) pandemic. 

Why don’t you come out to ny and join my wife and I as we save your fellow countryman’s and relative lives from this “flu” and see how bad it really is. Tell me as you look some of these folks I intubate in the eye and see what it looks like as they take what is highly likely to be their last unassisted breath that we should’ve done less

They're scenes; not scenarios.

It must be really rough, fishcane. Thank you for going back everyday, for trying to save those you can. It hurts my heart.

The media hates trump

Thank you. It is rough but it’s what we do so we carry on and try to leave it at work. We have young children so that’s our own personal worst case scenario. 

We had a nasty lung infection come through Corvallis back in January / Feb.  Wouldn't surprise me if that was the first wave brought on by returning foreign students and other travelers (we have a very large Asian student population).    Since there was no testing available back then, be curious if there were any positives on Chest Cat Scans, etc, that was just never made public (HIPAA).  

3 cheers for Fishcane and all of the healers and helpers. 

Hip hip... 

Hooray! 

In Colorado we howl like coyotes at 8pm every night to say thank you and to connect with each other. It's pretty cool. 

Thanks to all who are rising to the challenge

the fact is this was originally only a few people people bringing it here, to mostly our largely populated areas and in a month and a half it grew to do what we have here today

who the fuck wants to roll the dice on a much larger scale?

>>>>Since there was no testing available back then, be curious if there were any positives on Chest Cat Scans, etc, that was just never made public

Antibody testing when it becomes available should help answer that question.

Maybe OP is not in an area of the country yet where this has exploded. At the end of February and early March I was going out to bars, seeing bands, going about normal life. I was saying it's just like the flu. It's not like the flu. Much more contagious. More people died in my state in 9 days from this than the entire last flu season. And 800 people a day don't die in New York City from the flu. That's what's happening now.

Stop looking at yearly flu numbers.  Run the numbers against death from pneumonia.

Over 2,220 deaths today. That will be the highest single day total for the US so far.

Influenza and pneumonia deaths in 2017 in the US: 55,672. This is 25,000 deaths in about a month in the US. That's with shutting down. If you kept up that pace it would be many more deaths than pneumonia deaths. If we didn't shut down the number would be much worse.

...

Thank you, Fishcane. Take good care.   

Here's a relevant poem (for all here, not just you) that I connected to, published recently in YES! Magazine: 

An Anarchist Quaker’s Prayer to Soothe Anxiety

What my therapist said when she closed her office because of coronavirus.

BY AYU SUTRIASA

MAR 24, 2020

Hello sweet one. 

I see how much you care about the world, about your communities, about all of us surviving plagues and capitalism and a world on fire.

That clench in your throat, the knot in your gut, the tightness in your breath — this is how our bodies try to hold the world’s anguish.

We write the wrongness into our bodies, a beautiful and devastating lament.

Just because your body can hold all the tragedy, the panic, the tension, that it is holding right now, that doesn’t mean that you must go on holding it, all, forever.

The loving grandmother in you knows this to be true.

Set it down. Somewhere nearby, so you can pick it up again when you need to, but just for a moment, relinquish your illusions of control.

Allow yourself to See the many-headed Truth monster: it might not all be okay. It might end in flames and death and horror, no matter what you do.

Take a moment to acknowledge how fucking awful and sad that Truth is. And how not even the worst possible scenario would take away from your inherent worthiness.

Simultaneously, it is True that human beings have always fought for one another, cared for one another fiercely, and carried the world’s anguish in our bodies.

And there are small Truths, like that we cannot control the future, no matter how much we wish we could.

(Don’t worry when the Truths contradict one another, real Truths often do.)

No matter what, whether it turns out okay in the end or not, you carry the Divine within you.

You are Enough, not because of the things you do but because of who you are fundamentally. Intrinsically. Always and without exception.

Take a breath or two to allow yourself to Know this.

And when we pick up the anxiety again, let us aim for flexibility. Movement space for breath to get in and out of your rib cage, gentleness for the things we can’t do, and Integrity giving us the strength and resolve to turn our sometimes-excruciating caring into solidarity, mutual aid, and direct action.

We are each one person, breathing this one breath, with common Divinity.

We can do this. Together.

Note: This poem was an email response from my therapist when she closed her office because of coronavirus. The author has given permission for YES! to publish it, but wishes to remain anonymous.—Ayu Sutriasa

AYU SUTRIASA is the digital editor for YES!

https://www.yesmagazine.org/

(((((Fishcane and Mrs.))))

I'm glad I didn't go to the local Mardi Gras parades this year.

“I Want an Apology”: Black Doctor Who Tests Homeless for Coronavirus Handcuffed by Miami Police

https://www.democracynow.org/2020/4/15/dr_armen_henderson_arrest_miami

People can believe whatever they want.   Considering what's going on in my neck of the woods, (things like refrigerated trucks outside of hospitals & so much more) it seems a bit much to hear folks express the opinion that this is much to do about nothing. Or that it's all a plot to do whatever conspiracy theorists think is going on. It seems like an alternate universe where truth doesn't matter. Kind of like the flat world theorists. 

>>>>   We will see how it turns out for Sweden, which instead of isolating most people, has gone for the "herd immunity" approach. 

>>>   Deaths per 1M population.

>>>   US 75

>>>   Sweden 102

updated numbers:  https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/#countries

US           86   (16% increase since Tuesday)

Sweden 132  (30% increase since Tuesday)

related:

https://twitter.com/ObsoleteDogma/status/1250534493020094464

>People can believe whatever they want.   Considering what's going on in my neck of the woods, (things like refrigerated trucks outside of hospitals & so much more) it seems a bit much to hear folks express the opinion that this is much to do about nothing. Or that it's all a plot to do whatever conspiracy theorists think is going on. It seems like an alternate universe where truth doesn't matter. Kind of like the flat world theorists. 

The Sandy Hook school shooting deniers and conspiracy theorists were the worst of the worst. I'm sure Alex Jones is behind most of these Covid19 conspiracy theories too, he and  his flock are about as despicable as they come. Okay, probably on par with the QAnon creeps.

Interview from 2008 with 100 yr old 1918 Flu survivor 

.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7k20VFZeLKY

((((( Mrs. Edna Boone and her amazing family ))))

I guess national sports postponing their seasons isn't enough to tell some folks there is a real pandemic going on? The media did its part in fear propaganda like they always do but the toilet paper and food hoarders are responsible for their own actions in the end. I live in NJ and my cousin lives in NYC. He got it and has recovered but if anything the media was downplaying how bad things were in NYC the past couple of weeks. They have started to lower numbers because of the shuts downs and social distancing but there was a 24 he span where 763 people died in NYC last week. They started putting dead bodies in freight cars and even some church's, I saw. I'd say it's a very serious situation who chi we got a late start on. I don't like sitting any home any more than the next person and waiting to see what happens but my wife has pre existing conditions and has had pneumatic issues in the past so aim taking it as serious as I can. As far as things returning to "normal" I wouldn't see that happening until a vaccine has been developed.

The W.H.O. are a great source of factual information. 

https://www.who.int/news-room/q-a-detail/q-a-coronaviruses

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/15/nyregion/coronavirus-nj-andover-nursing-home-deaths.html

Heard u had an unwanted visitor

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.nytimes.com/2020/04/15/us/politics/coro...

https://www.politico.com/news/2020/04/15/coronavirus-hot-spots-farm-belt-189272

Ivankas twitter feed is pretty amusing/horrifying ....great for some middle of night non sleeping Coronavirus reality checks.

I especially enjoyed her photos of her "homemade" masks.

https://twitter.com/IvankaTrump/status/1249480004100132865

U S A !!!

1)  There comes a point where the amount of deaths is far beyond normal, and is not acceptable.

2)  Just allowing the pandemic to play out would place an overwhelming burden on the hospitals and medical services.  Many doctors and health professionals have already died from contracting the virus caring for the sick.  Even more of them will die if the restrictions are lifted.  They are the people you really want around during a medical crisis.

3)  The longer the medical system is overwhelmed with this crisis, other surgeries, procedures and medical check-ups are being delayed.  

Just remember, those N95 masks "can"  be used by up to 20 different health care employees, and "can" be sterilized up 20 different times !!!

For those lucky enough to even have access to one...

U S A !!!

Just remember, it's not the schools that make the decision to close for a snow day, it's the bus companies that have to drive in the snow. 
right now the hospitals are driving the bus. 

   "There are going to be times when we can't wait for somebody. Now, you're either on the bus or off the bus. If you're on the bus, and you get left behind, then you'll find it again."

-K. Kesey 

>>>> Why is this considered such a taboo topic?

It's a taboo topic for some because of the high value many people place on preserving human life, even if it is the lives of people who are old and sick and who would die soon anyway.  Its a very emotional topic and anyone who has been in a position of deciding when to pull the plug on a critically ill loved one can easily understand the natural urge to prolong life, irrespective of the cost.

But it shouldn't be a taboo topic for discussion and societies make decisions all the time that balance preserving human life with a myriad of other societal costs and benefits, whether it be setting speed limits and drinking water standards, waging war, enacting regulations on alcohol and tobacco, etc.   In the end, a balance must be struck and where that balance lies should be an open conversation. 

>>>>the longer the medical system is overwhelmed with this crisis, other surgeries, procedures and medical check-ups are being delayed.  

My brother returned to his hospital for the first time on Monday after being away for a month.  He is a neurologist and isn't seeing any Covid patients and says its been super quiet and slow.  He believes a lot of people are scared to come to the hospital and suspects many people are suffering from mini-strokes but are not seeking treatment.  

>>>    even if it is the lives of people who are old and sick and who would die soon anyway. 

Like 34-year old doctors?

Is it possible that many of the COVID-19 victims were not "old and sick and who would die soon anyway"?

Red Hatters like Tatters were saying a few weeks ago that H1N1 was much worse, and that Obama did nothing blah blah. Well, we're well past that now.

There are ways to start opening up segments of the economy. Not many restaurants can be profitable with only 1/3 or 1/2 of their seating available for proper spacing.

It boils down to testing, period, before we can see any larger gatherings of humans (unless you're in Detroit or Idaho).

https://twitter.com/atrupar/status/1250807416872189952

I'd be willing to allow huge MAGA rallies to be held.

Tatters, are you willing to die tomorrow? 

>>>At a certain point, what good does saving a certain segment of people if you cause the death and destruction of far more? Why is this considered such a taboo topic?

What about this Taboo subject...

https://khn.org/news/true-toll-of-covid-19-on-u-s-health-care-workers-unknown/

it's all about sticking it to the libtards who always think they know better than us.  we don't need no social distancing, plus jesus will heal us if we do get sick (at least that's what my mega church pastor told me). 

>>> Old people die. Sick people die. It's a sad fact of life.

your mother must be very proud of you.

India has this under control, the country that has so many people that they pile on top of trains to get around

we are now the shithole country that our leader warned us about

 Money is food. Money is medicine. Money is health

Fixed that for ya.

>>> Old people die. Sick people die. It's a sad fact of life.

You are a sad fact of life. 

>>>   Cratering the economy will ultimately kill far more people than this virus - stress, suicide, lack of insurance or ability purchase medications

Are you aware of any evidence supporting your assertion?

Dumb guy talking points from three weeks ago are still news?

WTF?  Are people bored of the Occupant melting down on live TV already?

OP sounds like Rand Paul

I'm rooting for his neighbor 

Yea but he thinks he’s clever so its interesting to watch as he tries to catch up while thinking he’s in the lead

     Whatever your feelings may be about Tucker Carlson, this evening's segment on the origins of the COVID-19 Virus is highly informative, it's increasingly likely it came from a level 4 bio lab in Wuhan, China...you probably won't see this being discussed on CNN or MSNBC anytime soon.

     https://youtu.be/JpwwHIYMCek

I’ve been saying that all along but....

what are their sources? So I can research a bit more

>> you probably won't see this being discussed on CNN or MSNBC anytime soon. <<

US investigates possibility of Covid-19 spread originating in Chinese lab

CNN's David Culver reports on the latest regarding China's transparency related to the origins and spread of Covid-19.

Source: CNN

https://www.cnn.com/videos/world/2020/04/16/china-transparency-covid-19-...

Boom

    You're right Ned, Fareed Zakaria [CFR] has really been blazing the trail on this

I trust the Chinese government as much as I do the Trump administration, so keeping an open mind as to the source.  Really doesn't matter in the short term now though.

This will be the most studied pandemic in human history, and there will be no shortage of Monday morning quarterbacks when all is said and done.

Although I personally think the West Coast approach is the most prudent and safest one, still curious about how the Swedish model will turn out over the long run, especially if it ends up insulating them from the second wave that some say will happen after things start opening up again.

     Don't worry, Joe Biden will lead the way...has anyone seen Joe lately?  #whereisjoe?

     https://youtu.be/MX5XMf69_ms

     https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wuhan_Institute_of_Virology

https://www.democracynow.org/2020/4/16/peter_daszak_coronavirus

why listen to a pandemic virologist expert when it's so fun to speculate?

     Turtle, respectfully...the "wet market" theory has been thoroughly discredited, it was the Wuhan bio lab.

Sources for your studies, please?

     My Rosetta Stone is to listen to the malarkey the Biden surrogates are pushing on any given day, then determine the exact opposite...it's a remarkably reliable methodology.

Byren has the best ironic posts! Tremendous work. I'm impressed with  his  Trump impersonation. Totally nailed the  sociopath and narcissist phrasing.

The coronavirus is very much under control in the USA.

We have it totally under control.

I’m not concerned at all.

It’s one person coming in from China.

We pretty much shut it down.

It will all work out well.

We’re in great shape.

Doesn’t spread widely at all in the United States because of the early actions that myself and my administration took.

There’s a chance it won’t spread.

It’s something that we have tremendous control over.

Looks like by April, you know, in theory, when it gets a little warmer, it miraculously goes away.

One day it’s like a miracle, it will disappear.

Just stay calm.

It will go away.

The Democrats are politicizing the coronavirus.

This is their new hoax.

Whatever happens, we’re totally prepared.

Totally ready.

We’re rated number one for being prepared.

We are so prepared like we never have been prepared.

Taking early intense action, we have seen dramatically fewer cases of the virus in the United States.

We’re very much ahead of everything.

This is a flu.

I didn’t know people died from the flu.

Here, we’re talking about a much smaller range.

It is very mild.

Some people will have this at a very light level.

Some of them go to work.

The mortality rate is much, much better.

In my opinion it’s way, way down.

I think it’s substantially below 1 percent.

A fraction of 1 percent.

I think the numbers are going to get progressively better as we go along.

This is just my hunch.

We have very little problem in this country.

We only have five people.

We only have 11 cases.

Out of billions of people, 15 people.

They’re getting better, and soon they’re all going to be better, hopefully.

We’re going very substantially down, not up.

The United States, because of what I did and what the administration did with China, we have 32 deaths at this point.

To this point, and because we have had a very strong border policy, we have had 40 deaths.

As of this moment, we have 50 deaths.

I have a feeling that a lot of the numbers that are being said in some areas are just bigger than they’re going to be.

Frankly, the testing has been going very smooth.

The tests are all perfect.

Anybody that wants a test can get a test.

The tests are beautiful.

We have a tremendous testing setup.

I don’t believe you need 40,000 or 30,000 ventilators.

We are very close to a vaccine.

A matter of months.

You take a solid flu vaccine, you don’t think that could have an impact?

Hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin, taken together, have a real chance to be one of the biggest game changers in the history of medicine.

Based on very strong evidence.

I would love to have the country opened up and just raring to go by Easter.

No way I’m going to cancel the convention.

Stock Market starting to look very good to me!

We’re the ones that gave the great response.

I’d rate it a 10.

We’ve done a fantastic job.

I think they should be appreciative.

Gallup just gave us the highest rating.

The highest on record.

I like this stuff.

I really get it.

Maybe I have a natural ability.

We think it’s going to have a very good ending.

We’re going to win faster than people think.

I hope.

This blindsided the world!

Who could have ever predicted a thing like this?

This was something that nobody has ever thought could happen to this country.

I’ve always known this is a real, this is a pandemic.

I felt it was a pandemic long before it was called a pandemic.

I always treated the Chinese Virus very seriously.

If you’re talking about the virus, no, that’s not under control for anyplace in the world.

I was talking about what we’re doing is under control, but I’m not talking about the virus.

I didn’t say Easter.

It was just an aspiration.

I am giving consideration to a QUARANTINE.

So you’re talking about 2.2 million deaths.

If we could hold that down…between 100,000 and 200,000, and we all together have done a very good job.

START MAKING VENTILATORS, NOW!!!!!!

FORD, GET GOING ON VENTILATORS, FAST!!!!!!

Invoke “P”.

I want our life back again.

It was nobody’s fault.

No, just things that happened.

I don’t take responsibility at all.

For what its worth, here is a BBC article laying out the publicly available evidence gathered to date or lack thereof regarding the theory it could have come from a Chinese lab experimenting on naturally occurring coronaviruses in bats:

https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-52318539

Regardless of where it came from, no time to worry about that now and using the pandemic to score political points on any side isn't really helping the situation.  Better to stick with science and what is best for the collective good.  

MAJORITY OF REPUBLICANS SAY COLLEGES ARE BAD FOR AMERICA

...

Foul Ball!

Merri Thanks for fixing that you are Absolutly correct. Food is Medicine eat and Stay well everybody!

On March 12th, The day I landed at JFK. I recieved a message from a trustworthy collegue that had a video

Of a french man reserching the "real origine" of this virus claimed you can look in  the french patens records and find an in depth accounting for a viris created in  a pasteur lab, as well as the vacine .Today this video has been pulled from the net and the archives of "brevets" patent and trademarks are nowhere to be found. I do have a friend who got the patent number before the vidio got pulled ,so it is fact checkable before the bad guys edited it! I really love the Talking Head's song

STOP MAKING SENSE

Why is the democratic leaders not just piecing together clips of the things that Trump has said for the past 4 years and run it as a commercial to jog memories? So afraid 
 

put what Liddle just posted and Whamo Trump starts crumbling. You have enough material for about 100 of them

and where are the democratic voices that you only hear at election time, Springsteen, PearlJam all the Move celebs. We just need one person to be able to debate Trump in Trump style, toe to toe nasty 

and Biden is not that guy, his school yard bully beating days are behind him by his actions

This guy Charles M. Lieber was arrested by the FBI regarding his ongoing work with Chinese scientists a few months back.
Actually he was getting paid quite well over a long period  of time,  presumably while collecting his Harvard salary at the same time.  Obviously Harvard knew he was working in China (he spent quite a lot of time there),  but hung him out to dry -- read the various Harvard publications linked below.

https://harvardmagazine.com/2020/01/lieber-arrest

"...An affidavit accompanying the criminal complaint in Boston further accuses Lieber of making false statements to the National Institutes of Health—a major funder of his research into nanoscale biological interfaces, such as transistors that can interact with intracellular biological machinery—as well as to Harvard itself, about his connections to the Thousand Talents program and the Wuhan University of Technology..."

https://www.thecrimson.com/article/2020/2/4/Lieber-arrest-analysis/

It was one of his Chinese colleagues that helped get him in trouble when he stole some biological materials;

"...Earlier in January, Customs and Border Patrol agents stopped Zaoseng Zheng, a researcher affiliated with Harvard Medical School, as he attempted to smuggle biological research from Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center to China..."

Interesting research he's been involved in over time -- tiny, tiny nanobots that enter cells and power themselves from within the cellular structure.  An earlier Harvard Magazine article regarding his work 10 years ago...

“Digital electronics are so powerful that they dominate our daily lives,” Lieber points out. “When scaled down, the difference between digital and living systems blurs, so that you have an opportunity to do things that sound like science fiction--things that people have only dreamed about.”

https://www.harvardmagazine.com/2011/01/virus-sized-transistors

I brought this guy up back in Feb,

I guess I needed to provide more info in the title, and thought folks might actually read ..

silly me...

https://www.vivalazone.org/other-stuff/meanwhile

https://www.npr.org/2020/01/28/800442646/acclaimed-harvard-scientist-is-arrested-accused-of-lying-about-ties-to-china

Here are the official Coronavirus guidelines:

1. Basically, you can't leave the house for any reason, but if you have to, then you can.

2. Masks are useless. But they will protect you. They can save you, no they can’t, they’re useless, but wear one anyway. Now they’re mandatory. But maybe. Or not.

3. Stores are closed, except for the ones that are open.

4. You should not go to the hospital unless you have to go there. Stay out of the ER at all costs unless you’re having a medical emergency then it’s okay.

5. This virus is deadly but still not too scary, except that sometimes it actually leads to a global disaster. Stay calm.

6. Gloves won't help, but they can still help. Especially if you wear the same pair for hours and everywhere you go, then you can not spread germs, nope. #science

7. Everyone needs to stay home, but it's important to go out to get exposure to the sun. Sunlight will kill the virus but not if the virus kills you first by walking in the sunlight where you may be exposed to the virus.

8. There is no shortage of groceries in the supermarket, but there are many things missing when you go there in the evening, but not in the morning. Sometimes.

9. The virus has no effect on children except those it has affected or will affect.

10. Animals are not affected, but there is still a cat that tested positive in Belgium in February when no one had been tested yet, and a tiger.. and one really deadly but also possibly fictional but very sick bat.

11. You will have many symptoms when you are sick, but you can also get sick without symptoms, have symptoms without being sick, or be contagious without having symptoms.

12. In order not to get sick, you have to eat well and exercise, but also never go out to the grocery store so just eat processed crap and stay inside your four walls but also stay healthy.

13. It's better to get some fresh air, but you may be arrested if you’re getting fresh air the wrong way and most importantly, don't go to a park, the fresh air there is deadly.

14. Under no circumstances should you go to retirement homes, but if you have to take care of the elderly and bring them food and medication then fine. Just wear gloves. The same ones. All day.

15. If you are sick, you can't go out, but you can go to the pharmacy to get your medications. Just don’t make eye contact cause you may spread your sickness that way.

16. You can get restaurant food delivered to the house, which may have been prepared by people who didn't wear masks or gloves. But you have to leave your groceries outside for 3 hours to be decontaminated by the fresh air that also may have virus particles floating around in it.

17. Taxi drivers are immune to the virus apparently since you can still take a taxi ride with a random taxi driver. Just don’t take the taxi to your mom’s house because you know. Stay away from your mom.

18. You can walk around with a friend if you stay six feet apart but don’t visit with your family if they don't live under the same roof as you. Even if you’ve all been locked inside for two months already. You may still have the virus and just not know it yet. You’ll find out. Wait another week. Wasn’t that a week? Might be the next one. Keep waiting.

19. You are safe if you maintain the appropriate social distance, but you can’t go out with friends or strangers at the safe social distance. Social distancing means you shouldn’t leave your house and don’t be social, except you may go to the liquor store but don’t socialize there while you’re being socially distant.

20. The virus remains active on different surfaces for two hours, no, four, no, six, no, we didn't say hours, maybe days? But it takes a damp environment. Oh no, not necessarily.

21. The virus stays in the air - well no, or yes, maybe, especially in a closed room, in one hour a sick person can infect ten, so if it falls, all our children were already infected at school before it was closed. But remember, if you stay at the recommended social distance you should be ok, however in certain circumstances you should maintain a greater distance, which, studies show, the virus can travel even further, maybe.

22. We count the number of deaths but we don't know how many people are infected as we have only tested so far those who were "almost dead" to find out if that's what they will die of…

23. The virus will only disappear if we achieve collective immunity.. but stay inside until the virus disappears.

(Original author unknown, revised & edited from original)

Are we really trusting the ones in charge?

From the US Dept. Of Justice site --

https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/harvard-university-professor-and-two-chin...

"...According to court documents, since 2008, Dr. Lieber who has served as the Principal Investigator of the Lieber Research Group at Harvard University, which specialized in the area of nanoscience, has received more than $15,000,000 in grant funding from the National Institutes of Health (NIH) and Department of Defense (DOD).  These grants require the disclosure of significant foreign financial conflicts of interest, including financial support from foreign governments or foreign entities. Unbeknownst to Harvard University beginning in 2011, Lieber became a “Strategic Scientist” at Wuhan University of Technology (WUT) in China and was a contractual participant in China’s Thousand Talents Plan from in or about 2012 to 2017..."

"...Under the terms of Lieber’s three-year Thousand Talents contract, WUT paid Lieber $50,000 USD per month, living expenses of up to 1,000,000 Chinese Yuan (approximately $158,000 USD at the time) and awarded him more than $1.5 million to establish a research lab at WUT.  In return, Lieber was obligated to work for WUT “not less than nine months a year” by “declaring international cooperation projects, cultivating young teachers and Ph.D. students, organizing international conference[s], applying for patents and publishing articles in the name of” WUT..."

The Chinese "research assistant"  got caught at Logan with a couple dozen vials of Cancer stuff --

"...Zaosong Zheng

In August 2018, Zheng entered the United States on a J-1 visa and conducted cancer-cell research at Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center in Boston from Sept. 4, 2018, to Dec. 9, 2019. It is alleged that on Dec. 9, 2019, Zheng stole 21 vials of biological research and attempted to smuggle them out of the United States aboard a flight destined for China.  Federal officers at Logan Airport discovered the vials hidden in a sock inside one of Zheng’s bags, and not properly packaged.  It is alleged that initially, Zheng lied to officers about the contents of his luggage, but later admitted he had stolen the vials from a lab at Beth Israel..."

Then there's the other one-- Lieber had the bad luck to stumble upon Chinese spies for his research assistants.  It's hard to find decent research assistants. 

Yanqing Ye

According to the indictment, Ye is a Lieutenant of the People’s Liberation Army (PLA), the armed forces of the People’s Republic of China and member of the Chinese Communist Party (CCP).  On her J-1 visa application, Ye falsely identified herself as a “student” and lied about her ongoing military service at the National University of Defense Technology (NUDT), a top military academy directed by the CCP.  It is further alleged that while studying at Boston University’s (BU) Department of Physics, Chemistry and Biomedical Engineering from October 2017 to April 2019, Ye continued to work as a PLA Lieutenant completing numerous assignments from PLA officers such as conducting research, assessing U.S. military websites and sending U.S. documents and information to China.

But Harvard had no idea any of this was going on;  the guy's getting over $600,000 for 9 months work,  three year contract from Wuhan,   while presumably still working for Harvard,  but no one noticed anything odd.

"...Unbeknownst to Harvard University beginning in 2011, Lieber became a “Strategic Scientist” at Wuhan University of Technology (WUT) in China and was a contractual participant in China’s Thousand Talents Plan from in or about 2012 to 2017.  China’s Thousand Talents Plan is one of the most prominent Chinese Talent recruit plans that are designed to attract, recruit, and cultivate high-level scientific talent in furtherance of China’s scientific development, economic prosperity and national security.  These talent programs seek to lure Chinese overseas talent and foreign experts to bring their knowledge and experience to China and reward individuals for stealing proprietary information..."

< viris created in  a pasteur lab >

Nope. Watch fox,  go fringe + stay misinformed.

'Experts overwhelmingly say analysis of the coronavirus gnome rules out the possibility that it was engineered by humans'

Trump, aides float outlier theory on origins of coronavirus
https://apnews.com/887c6ae4116951bb9bc7375e3dc8b158

Whose experts are you talkin about brevet dated 2002

I REALLY WANT TO BELIEVE

< The media hates trump >

According to the latest Quinnipiac poll, anybody with half a brain hates chump

Elective surgery will continue to be on hold while we replenish our supply of ppe, we were inadequate in our preparedness for such an event. But like everything it seems, no one ever wants to be prepared for something that hasn’t already happened 

i need ear surgery.

Pooh Message:

a bunch of half brained condescending Idiots

Maybe they should use their full brain , Ras. 

There shouldn't be bias in the media but here we are.

>>>>You don't need to run a Quinnipiac study to find the answer. The people at the bottom are going to suffer greatly, in significant numbers. 

Its not a "Qunnipiac study," but here is a report issued by the United Nations yesterday on the socio-economic impacts of Covid-19 mitigation measures on children:

https://www.un.org/sites/un2.un.org/files/policy_brief_on_covid_impact_o...

The report finds, not surprisingly, that poor children will be the most hard hit:

"Children are not the face of this pandemic. But they risk being among its biggest victims. While they have thankfully been largely spared from the direct health effects of COVID-19 - at least to date – the crisis is having a profound effect on their wellbeing. All children, of all ages, and in all countries, are being affected, in particular by the socio-economic impacts and, in some cases, by mitigation measures that may inadvertently do more harm than good. This is a universal crisis and, for some children, the impact will be lifelong. Moreover, the harmful effects of this pandemic will not be distributed equally. They are expected to be most damaging for children in the poorest countries, and in the poorest neighbourhoods, and for those in already disadvantaged or vulnerable situations."

Anyway, make of it what you will.

Bills aren't canceled! Makes no sense, really. Federal banks charging you in times where you literally cannot work because the whole country is shut down. What exactly do they expect to happen? The whole "stay at home" thing is just for comfortable millionaires or billionaires who don't have to worry about bills. For the rest of us this who have to work everyday for a living this is just a nightmare and will continue to get worse.

You can work Tin Pan.  Just got to get creative,  survival of the fittest. 

Banks aren't "federal".

But I agree, open the country up!  The media frenzy needs to end.

< shouldn't be bias in the media but here we are >

Puleeeeeeeze, bro. Since forever. But there's big differences.

If you care about an ounce of truth, and I'll just stick to tv news - fox bias supports clumps lies. Every other major national network under the sun ( abc,cbs,nbc,npr, etc etc) brings his and his administrations disastrous lies to light. That's their bias g. You think any different, yer only fooling yourself 

     "I'll just stick to tv news" 

     ...that explains a lot

This guy Frank Plummer is an interesting character.  Article linked below explains that he died in Africa a while back.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/manitoba/scientist-frank-plummer-death-1....

Back in July,  some Chinese nationals got in trouble at this Bio lab in Winnipeg --

https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2019/07/mystery-surrounds-ouster-chinese...

Both of those are pretty Vanilla mainstream media sites.
Here we get some offbeat,  "nutcase site" out of India that explains the connection between Plummer and the Chinese agents.

"What is not mentioned in the CBC report however is that Plummer worked in the same National Microbiology Laboratory (NML) in Winnipeg, Canada from where Chinese Biowarfare agent Xiangguo Qiu and her colleagues smuggled SARS Coronavirus to China’s Wuhan Institute of Virology where it is believed to have been weaponized and leaked."

https://sarahwestall.com/frank-plummer-canadian-scientist-key-to-coronav...

There's so many narratives to this story.  Takes a lot of time to read and attempt to connect the puzzle pieces as to the origins of this strain.

https://www.nasdaq.com/articles/moderna-gets-u.s.-government-grant-to-de...

This company "Moderna"  is something to keep an eye on.  The article says they are working upon the vaccine and just got a huge gov't grant.

https://redmondregister.com/2020/04/06/moderna-nasdaqmrna-upgraded-to-bu...

Their ticker symbol on the NASDAQ is MRNA.  Nothing to do with 'Messenger RNA'  just a clever ticker symbol no doubt.
But hey,  that half-billion dollar gov't grant will buy them plenty of test tubes and centrifuges and stuff.

Get in on the ground floor !

<<Sweeping testing of the entire crew of the coronavirus-stricken U.S. aircraft carrier Theodore Roosevelt may have revealed a clue about the pandemic: The majority of the positive cases so far are among sailors who are asymptomatic, officials say.

The possibility that the coronavirus spreads in a mostly stealthy mode among a population of largely young, healthy people showing no symptoms could have major implications for U.S. policy-makers, who are considering how and when to reopen the economy. 

It also renews questions about the extent to which U.S. testing of just the people suspected of being infected is actually capturing the spread of the virus in the United States and around the world. 

The Navy’s testing of the entire 4,800-member crew of the aircraft carrier - which is about 94% complete - was an extraordinary move in a headline-grabbing case that has already led to the firing of the carrier’s captain and the resignation of the Navy’s top civilian official. 

Roughly 60 percent of the over 600 sailors who tested positive so far have not shown symptoms of COVID-19, the potentially lethal respiratory disease caused by the coronavirus, the Navy says. The service did not speculate about how many might later develop symptoms or remain asymptomatic. 

“With regard to COVID-19, we’re learning that stealth in the form of asymptomatic transmission is this adversary’s secret power,” said Rear Admiral Bruce Gillingham, surgeon general of the Navy. 

The figure is higher than the 25% to 50% range offered on April 5 by Dr. Anthony Fauci, director of the National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases and a member of President Donald Trump’s coronavirus task force.>>

(there's still several paragraphs more)

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-usa-military-sympt...

TRUMP IS A MONSTER = GO TO HELL FUCKER !!

______

TRUMP IS A MONSTER = GO TO HELL FUCKER !!

______

Byren hates America (sad face).

     Allow me to state the obvious, the truth as to the origin of the outbreak is relevant to the current dynamic stateside for many reasons...but the reason it's receiving an "all hands on deck" cover up from the media [which has basically morphed into open advocacy of the DNC agenda cleverly disguised as journalism, but that's another discussion] is once the truth surfaces that this was a man made disaster from a level 4 bio lab in China it will most certainly shine a bright light on the corruption surrounding Joe & Hunter Biden's history with the Chinese Communist Party, namely the $1.5 billion deposit into Hunter's shady investment firm days after a state visit on Air Force 2 with his father to Beijing, and the story that broke a few days ago where months after he declared otherwise, he still maintains a seat on the board of directors of a Chinese company.

     https://www.nationalreview.com/news/hunter-biden-still-listed-on-board-o...

     Figure it out...or pretend not to, but that's the reason you're seeing a DEFCON 5 level pushback from Biden's foot soldiers in the establishment media.

>Roughly 60 percent of the over 600 sailors who tested positive so far have not shown symptoms of COVID-19, the potentially lethal respiratory disease caused by the coronavirus, the Navy says.

the other issue is the false positive rates, reported by some to be as high as 30%

Simple treatment break though for treating Covid 19 . heard about this from my nephew who is a nurse in NYC treating Covid 19 patients, his hospital helped pioneer this therapy, and it's making a huge impact on recovery rates

https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/14/health/coronavirus-prone-positioning/inde...

I've seen a few docs talking about prone positioning. Sounds like it's huge.

Byren the biggest argument against China intentionally infecting the US with the virus is that the US is the biggest customer for China. It simply doesn't add up.

The pessimist prediction:  Charlie Stross

Vaccine development will take a flat minimum of 12 months. Then another 1-3 months to ramp up (on a Manhattan Project management basis) and a to-some-extent-overlapping 1-3 months to roll out around the various nations that are involved.

Meanwhile.

Lockdown can't be sustained more than 1-2 weeks after peak ICU occupancy passes, so it will be lifted in mid-May in the UK and possibly as early as May 1st in the USA. Trump is shooting for May 1st because he's been told the economy will take 6 months to recover, minimum, and he's shooting for the November election deadline. 

So. The immediate peak hospital occupancy will pass, lockdown will be lifted sector by sector (or all at once) and region by region ... and the 50% of COVID19 cases who are asymptomatic will go back to work, mingling with the uninfected.

1-4 weeks later there will be a secondary surge in infections and it'll follow the same exponential growth as the first spike in Feb/March. And lockdown will resume, probably in mid-June.

If the howls of rage at the first lockdown are deafening, the second lockdown will be worse:  Expect civil disobedience and possibly summer riots unless central banks throw money at the grassroots -- and not $1200 for 10 weeks: more like $1200 per week.

I do not know what the hell Trump will do when his "get America open again" agenda runs into pandemic spike #2, around the beginning of June. Expect denial and heel-dragging and a much worse death toll, this time reaching the rural heartland (where hospitals may not have any ICU beds at all: there's going to be carnage). By August he may well be in full-on meltdown. I wouldn't even be surprised to see a second round of impeachment hearings as the Senate Republican Party tries to throw him under the bus so they can pivot to President Pence. Assuming it's not too late to save their campaign ...

By September there's going to be social unrest just about everywhere that hasn't nailed down a massive social spending/social security project on a scale that makes the New Deal look restrained and conservative.

And that's going to be the picture until June or July 2022.

http://www.antipope.org/charlie/blog-static/2020/04/itll-all-be-over-by-...

Time to liberate the White House

Stable Genius Brain:  "I'll blame China for my three months of non-response."

Super Genius Brain:  "I'll claim it was  Chinese military attack...that I did nothing about for three months".

I have total authority

I take no responsibility at all

To be fair, it's not Trump's fault that Republicans failed to remove him from office.  They blew their opportunity.

https://twitter.com/JoeNBC/status/1251268434383515648

>>>>>Are you aware of any evidence supporting your assertion?

This is how to end any discussion on the internet. Ask a simple question that won't get answered.

     Ned, I appreciate your question...I double checked and there was no profanity or ill will...you're to be congratulated.

     It may or may not have been an international act, to some degree or another that's not the discussion point, if it was a man made disaster from a level 4 bio lab in China that's an entirely different discussion than a bowl of bat soup in a wet market...that would change the entire dynamic of the discussion...because the Bidens are tied to the the hip with a long documented history of corruption involving the Chinese Communist Party, the keepers of the narrative are hard at work this evening.

     This is developing quickly.

     Follow the money.   

     Edit: "intentional" rather than "international"

     It may or may not have been an intentional act, to some degree or another that's not the discussion point, if it was a man made disaster from a level 4 bio lab in China that's an entirely different discussion than a bowl of bat soup in a wet market...that would change the entire dynamic of the discussion...because the Bidens are tied to the the hip with a long documented history of corruption involving the Chinese Communist Party, the keepers of the narrative are hard at work this evening.

     J. S. Bach - Sonatas & Partitas For Lute

     https://youtu.be/pTBooio3h9U

FTG^

Survivor winner Tod Herzog appeared on the Dr. Phil Show in 2013 to discuss his ongoing struggle with alcoholism.

He was so inebriated during filming, that he had to be helped onto the stage by Dr. Phil and several other staff members.

Fast forward five years later: Herzog finally reveals his side of the story. He claims he was sober when he arrived on set in Los Angeles but was left alone with two bottles of vodka and mixers like orange juice and Red Bull.

He also claims he was given a Xanax prior to filming to “calm his nerves”, stating, “this was a deliberate move to make for better TV.”

If his allegations are true, Herzog was placed in immediate danger by the producers of The Doctor Phil Show. The American Addiction Center states that “Mixing Xanax and alcohol increases the potential that one will experience hallucinations and/or delusions or even seizures compared to when using either drug alone.”

While there’s no way we can know what really went on behind the scenes, these accusations are deeply troubling.

OAKLAND (CBS SF) — Ten California district attorneys led by Alameda County D.A. Nancy O’Malley Monday announced an approximately $1 million settlement of allegations that a Minnesota pillow company engaged in false and misleading advertising.

The lawsuit alleged the company conducted false and misleading advertising by claiming, without any reliable scientific evidence, that the foam pillows could help people suffering from fibromyalgia, insomnia, migraines, sleep apnea, snoring and restless leg syndrome.
It goes on to indicate that they advertise themselves as the "official bed pillow" of the National Sleep Foundation, but My Pillow has an undisclosed financial relationship with the National Sleep Foundati

>>>  Totally. The ultimate chess move. Checkmate. Digital high-five.

No.

I just knew:

1) you were wrong;

2)  evidence was contrary to your assertions;

and

3) you would avoid the question, and try some kind of lame way out of it.

I was indeed correct on all three, I think.

Evidence that your assertion was unsupported, and, indeed, incorrect:

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/great-depression-had-little-effect-on-death-rates-46713514/

https://www.npr.org/2018/01/09/576669311/hidden-brain-great-recession-deaths

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-019-08539-w

Abstract

Previous studies have consistently shown the recurrent relationship between macroeconomic cycles and changes in mortality trends, so that recessions are generally associated with periods of faster life expectancy rise, and periods of economic growth with slower reductions or even increases in mortality trends.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0277953617304495

Abstract

Mortality rates generally decline during economic recessions in high-income countries

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-019-00210-0

23 January 2019

How the next recession could save lives

Death rates have dropped during past economic downturns...

I guess Ned doesn't know what a Federal Bank is. Not really surprising. Do you have no life or do you just try to troll for no reason? Either way leave me the fuck alone you thread stalking asshole. Go bother somebody else.

I have a my pillow...

     Bret Baier shares updates on explosive report about coronavirus origins

     April 17th, 2020

      https://youtu.be/X5Dued_2ulY

     ...it sounds as if the virus itself wasn't "man made", but the outbreak was a result of human error allowing the virus to escape from the level 4 bio lab in Wuhan, which preceded a massive cover up by the Chinese Communist Party, which is a seismic development...this was not a bowl of soup in a wet market.

This has been discussed for months. Guess you have to wait for fox to make it a headline before you start paying attention, eh?

     Fish, while you're correct it's been "discussed" the developments in the last 24 hours have been groundbreaking as far as it being "established", there's a difference...to suggest otherwise is a bit disingenuous.  You'd be hard pressed to exaggerate the significance of this investigative reporting...it's not just Fox News, this thing is breaking in real-time all over the world.

Didn't Donald say that the US and China are ‘working closely together’ in the fight against coronavirus?  

Breaking news:  Jerry Head Bryen in dispute with Donald.  Film at 11.:00.   

     Tucker Carlson on the Latest Developments of the Origins of the Outbreak 

     April 17th, 2020

     https://youtu.be/e_6nvGmkCoY

Bry still convinced he is on the cutting edge of breaking news...

No need spreading fox filth here shitbird, only total ra tards like yourself can't see thru ruprets propaganda machine

Hey Bry still waiting on that big Brennan,  Comey, Obama take down you were promising that was coming any day now. What happened to that? I'll be waiting for some laughable Bill Barr comments as your reply. You're a joke just like your president.  

     Let me put it another way...within the last 24-48 hours the narrative has pivoted 180 degrees from the somewhat unavoidable  happenstance of a bowl of soup at a wet market to a disastrous spillover from a level 4 bio lab in Wuhan, China and the ensuing cover up by the Chinese Communist Party with malice & intent leading to the deaths of countless human beings and possibly a worldwide economic depression and there are those that would describe that as an insignificant development?  Is that more or less what you're suggesting?

So Trump ignored the bioweapon for three months?

     Infinite indeed.

It’s always gotta be about the narrative 

     Figure it out or fail to do so, whatever gets you through the night...it's a big deal.

That lab was considered a hazard for years.

Is that why Trump pulled the CDC out of China last year?

I that why Trump dissolved  the pandemic team at the National Security council?

from 2017

https://www.nature.com/news/inside-the-chinese-lab-poised-to-study-world...

>So Trump ignored the bioweapon for three months?
 

he was too busy holding rallies and taking golf vacations, and being a reality TV POTUS..and the excuse is that Trump was distracted by the Impeachement hearings, not to mention all of his time watching TV and appearing on FOX. 

I'm disappointed in the quacks here, I've heard 'better'  conspiracy theories - some business about Bill Gates  being behind the fake virus so he could infect everyone with a evil vaccine to make everyone sterile. It's like the 9-11 conspiracy nuts have someone new to quack about. 
 

How about this:

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/trump-secret-payments-sons-wife-girlfrien...

     From the article you just posted...in hindsight, an interesting statement:

     "Editors’ note, January 2020: Many stories have promoted an unverified theory that the Wuhan lab discussed in this article played a role in the coronavirus outbreak that began in December 2019. Nature knows of no evidence that this is true; scientists believe the most likely source of the coronavirus to be an animal market."

It’s a big deal but the virus isn’t. Ok

     ^ ?????

Bryen found the smoking gun, after he shot himself in the foot

Trump funneling donor cash into his kids’s households builds on his observe of funneling it into his personal pocket, which started in 2016, proper after he grew to become the presumptive Republican nominee and commenced elevating massive quantities of GOP cash. Trump instantly quintupled the rent he was charging his marketing campaign at Trump Tower, from $35,458 per 30 days to $169,758. He additionally started billing the marketing campaign five- and six-figure sums to be used of his motels and golf programs for internet hosting fundraisers.

These practices continued after his election and thru to at the present time. His marketing campaign nonetheless pays Trump Tower $37,542 a month in lease, although it’s primarily based in a high-rise workplace constructing in Arlington, Virginia. The marketing campaign and the RNC proceed to host fundraisers at Trump’s properties, placing hundreds of thousands of dollars at a time into his personal money registers.

All of these entities are owned by the Trump Group, which in flip is owned by a belief that Trump created after his election and of which he’s the only beneficiary.

“Grift and graft is the household enterprise,” mentioned Robert Weissman, president of the liberal group Public Citizen.

The funds to Guilfoyle and Lara Trump may additionally complicate the Trump marketing campaign’s efforts to assault presumptive Democratic nominee Joe Biden’s son Hunter Biden for accepting profitable board memberships when his father was vp. 

     Sure Nancy....nothing to see here, move along...right?  No significance?

     "Trump funneling donor cash into his kids’s households"...this is relevant to what?

Doesn’t spread widely at all in the United States because of the early actions that myself and my administration took.

There’s a chance it won’t spread.

It’s something that we have tremendous control over.

Looks like by April, you know, in theory, when it gets a little warmer, it miraculously goes away.

One day it’s like a miracle, it will disappear.

Just stay calm.

It will go away.

The Democrats are politicizing the coronavirus.

This is their new hoax.

     Strong work ignorance...are those recycled from Thursday evening?  Maybe get some fresh material?  How about an original thought or observation for the sake of the discussion?  Any thoughts on the disaster at the level 4 bio lab? 

best Bry  ironic post yet ^

Tinfoil  MAGA hats are the bomb. 
 

can we give OP a chance to expound on his conspiracy theory without Bry claiming all the cray cray, please?

I know, I shouldn't encourage them but since I don't see much of this conspiracy shit elsewhere it's good to know which  Alex Jones talking points are trending. 

     Nancy...how about you?  An original thought or observation on the catastrophe at the bio lab in Wuhan?  I'll wait.

This is heartbreaking. On a micro level, you hope this never happens to you or your loved ones.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/18/nyregion/coronavirus-deaths-nyc.html?...

On a macro level, the idiots here and you know who you are, just feel free, go right out, forget about social distancing. As soon as you have worked up an extraordinary social contact list, I suggest you call you Congressman and schedule a tour of the White House. Please.

Bry is Waiting. And waiting...such a good stalker. 

and yes, the situation is tragic here and these conspiracy nuts can go duck themselves. 
 

thankful for Governor Newsome and all he's doing during this crisis, instead of spreading lies and worse.

those on the front lines risking their lives treating people sick with COVID19 and grieving families deserve better than the shit stain in the White House and those who support him.

This administration is like keystone cops with regard to this virus. It’s amusing to watch the story change pretty much every day and Bry all a sudden discovering such a breaking scoop 

     ...and waiting, and waiting, in vein I suppose 

     Fish, once again...being discussed v. being established, two different things...your thoughts?

I think it’s pathetic to watch something so seriously detrimental to the health of every being on this planet get turned into a campaign speech each and every day. I was never an Obama fan and am a registered Republican who actually saw the endorsement announcement the other night and wished for an orator who could lead us thru the darkness instead of the buffoons that my brothers and sisters have dropped everything to support 

     So...you're a Biden guy?

     What are your thoughts as to the Biden's history of corruption involving the Chinese Communist Party?

Trump’s seemingly perpetual battle with China has been riddled with apparent attempts by the Chinese government to influence the president.

Although it’s difficult to ascertain whether these attempts have been successful, they demonstrate that foreign governments will use whatever avenues they can in attempts to influence U.S. policy amid crucial negotiations and foreign policy decisions.

Right off the bat, China did its best to appease the incoming president, approving a “TRUMP” trademark for Trump’s construction-related services in China just days after Trump’s election night win. Although it might not seem like much, the trademark had proven to be elusive one for Trump. He unsuccessfully filed for the trademark in December 2006, then unsuccessfully appealed to Chinese courts.

The trademark was one of 77 approved Chinese trademarks Trump owned as of February 2017. One month later, China granted preliminary approval for another 38 trademarks in a hasty move described as “weird” by one Hong Kong intellectual property consultant.

President Donald Trump and First Lady Melania Trump pose for a photo with Chinese President Xi Jingping and his wife, Mrs. Peng Liyuan, Thursday, April 6, 2017, at the entrance of Mar-a-Lago in Palm Beach, Fl. (Official White Photo by D. Myles Cullen)

Still, Trump did not maintain an equable relationship with China going into his presidency.

On Dec. 2, 2016, Trump broke prior protocol with a phone call to Taiwan President Tsai Ing-wen. Trump followed that up by musing that the U.S. might not be bound by its longstanding position that Taiwan is part of “one China,” further antagonizing China.

The call may not have been happenstance. Former Senator Bob Dole worked behind the scenes as a foreign agent lobbying for the government of Taiwan, arranging contacts for high-level Taiwanese officials with Trump campaign staff and facilitating a Taiwanese delegation’s attendance at the Republican convention when Trump was nominated.

Multiple reports indicate Trump was considering developing a series of luxury hotels and resorts in Taiwan around that time. Shortly before Trump’s election, a businesswoman with a letter stating that she is a “sales ambassador” for Trump’s businesses named Chen Siting, who is also known as Charlyne Chen, reportedly met with the mayor of the northern Taiwanese city of Taoyuan about a “major investment” in building luxury hotels as part of the island’s new airport development. Reportedly giving a speech at a Friends of Trump banquet in central Taipei on November 1, 2016, she claimed that Trump’s business was interested in investing in Taiwan and that his son, Eric, would visit later that year.

The month before Trump’s election, Anne-Marie Donoghue, the global director of transient sales & Asia for Trump, hotels posted a photo from a visit to Taiwan noting that she was in Taipei for work with the message “Work trip but it has been so fun!!!” The Trump Organization denied making visits to Taiwan for development purposes.

Following a February 2017 call with China’s leader Xi Jinping, Trump appears to have reversed course on Taiwan, agreeing to honor the “one China” policy. No further developments on prospective Trump business interests in Taiwan have been reported since that time.  

As Trump’s term continued, it became evident that Ivanka Trump would also benefit from China’s apparent attempts to tempt the Trump administration. On April 6, 2017, the same night Ivanka Trump dined with Jinping at Mar-A-Lago, the Chinese government granted her approval for three new trademarks to sell products related to jewelry, bags and spa services.

Along with trade, Chinese telecoms ZTE and Huawei emerged as major focal points in the foreign policy battle between the U.S. and China. U.S. officials consider both companies to be controlled by the Chinese government and thus a potential national security threat. The Trump administration in April 2018 banned American firms from selling parts to ZTE for seven years, dealing a crippling blow to the Chinese firm.

That ban didn’t last long. In what was considered a quid-pro-quo by some and a coincidence by others, Trump in May 2018 tweeted he would to find a way to save ZTE shortly after China approved seven new trademarks for Ivanka Trump’s various business measures. The deal also came shortly after reports that a state-owned Chinese company would provide $500 million for a Trump-licensed project in Indonesia.

Trump delivered on his promise, striking a deal with ZTE last June to lift crippling sanctions in exchange for a $1 billion fine and a restructuring of the company’s leadership. The decision was widely panned by Trump’s advisers and Republican allies in Congress. The Senate swiftly voted to block the deal, arguing that ZTE is a national security threat, but both chambers of Congress later agreed to drop an effort to derail the deal. Trump followed up in July 2018 by lifting the ban on ZTE just three months after it was enforced.

In November 2018, Ivanka Trump received approval for another 16 new Chinese trademarks ranging from voting machines to sausage casing to handbags. Amid heated trade talks with the U.S. in January 2019, China approved five new trademarks for Ivanka Trump.

However, the relationship between Trump and Beijing has since turned hostile, further provoked by an escalating trade war between the two powers, as well as the U.S.’ attempt to extradite Huawei executive Meng Wanzhou from Canada over charges of financial fraud. Since working out a deal with ZTE, Trump has paved the way to ban Chinese telecommunications firms from taking part in the next-generation 5G wireless network in the U.S.

ZTE, for its part, has directly lobbied the Trump administration and Congress, spending a company record $3.8 million in 2018 and hiring a host of former members including Connie Mack, Norm Coleman and Joe Lieberman, who argued he isn’t actually lobbying for ZTE despite formally registering as a lobbyist for the telecom giant.

Huawei has spent less on domestic lobbying — $165,000 last year — but the embattled company in March hired several U.S. firms as foreign agents to shape its image in the states.

Trump’s efforts to limit the companies came as Trump indicated they could be a bargaining chip in a potential U.S.-China trade deal.

At least 49 of Trump’s Chinese trademarks are up in 2020, potentially giving China a bargaining chip of its own as it negotiates with the Trump administration. Additionally, the state-owned Industrial and Commercial Bank of China has a lease with Trump Tower in New York City worth an estimated $1.5 million per year, slated to end in October 2019. Trump’s New York property on 1290 Avenue of the Americas, partially indebted to the state-owned Bank of China, earned Trump more than $5 million last year. In China, the business of attempting to sell access to Trump through Mar-a-Lago memberships and straw campaign contributions has become a new industry of sorts, the Washington Post reported. 

I’m a never trump Republican unlike the rest of my party who was only until the election then abandoned reason for madness...figure it out

     Never Trumper...that's fair enough, but what about the question I asked:

     "What are your thoughts as to the Biden's history of corruption involving the Chinese Communist Party?"

We can go back and forth all day on this. Please outline your reasons why I should vote for Trump and don't mention Biden at all. What are his specific policies that make him the best choice?

Biden’s connections are cool imo..the connections run deep throughout the political landscape, if you think there is a politician who isn’t connected to the world then you aren’t paying enough attention to the entire picture. What we need is someone who can build bridges not walls

>>>  Any thoughts on the disaster at the level 4 bio lab? 

yes: you are gonna need a better conspiracy theory.

https://twitter.com/joshmich/status/1251547405092257793    (Prof @ Johns Hopkins)

But then we can’t be as political that way!

b-ry reads national review and listens to tucker the fucker. no wonder so mal-informed.

if you would have watched my video with a virologist who has worked at lab in question, maybe...just maybe you could digest this....

no, it's much funner to engage in conspiracy.

funny that this is going down on trump's watch,no?

People who should be banned from ever participating in a thread dealing with < what is really going on here? >

Any and all trumper lumps.

Their total blind devotion to lord fuckwad shows they lack the cognitive ability to matter in any discussion dealing with the goings on. 

Better off sticking to their Jerry worship hogwash

     Sorry for the delay, I had to run an errand...where were we...oh yes, Fish's response to my question regarding the Biden's scandalous history with the Chinese Communist Party:

     "Biden’s connections are cool imo..the connections run deep throughout the political landscape, if you think there is a politician who isn’t connected to the world then you aren’t paying enough attention to the entire picture. What we need is someone who can build bridges not walls"

     First off, I appreciate your honest response...it's actual "back & forth" dialogue, how refreshing!  It is a bit troublesome though that you see no problem with blatantly selling the White House to the highest bidder...in light of current events do you believe that might be relevant, as far as the presumptive nominee being compromised in such a way with the country that knowingly allowed a pandemic?  How do you think he might handle that question in a debate, assuming he agrees to show up to a debate?

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/charles-lieber-arrested-coronavirus/

we knowingly allowed the pandemic as much as anyone else...we certainly didn’t do our part in a timely fashion to prevent it despite being told we were

If Biden is propped up like weekend at Bernie's he will have a team in place that will do a better job for the nation then this dip shit. Trump can't keep anyone that has worked in this administration in place. They all leave or get forced out.  All this guy cares about is himself winning and his own thin skinned ego. He only want's to reopen the economy now with the hope it improves before the election. It's a self serving move. He denied the problem before shutting down with the hope it would just "vanish". We see how that went. He has a great "gut" instinct, lol. 

     "we knowingly allowed the pandemic as much as anyone else...we certainly didn’t do our part in a timely fashion to prevent it despite being told we were"

     Again, I appreciate your honest response...so what you're suggesting is China is no more culpable than we are as far as being responsible for, then subsequently covering up [including the disappearance and presumed murder of scientists and journalists] the outbreak...am I correct that's what you're suggesting?  Thanks

I don’t believe I mentioned anything about any subsequent actions related to the virus by any nation, only that we allowed and knowingly contributed to its spread

     Oh...I see, but in your opinion there's an equivalence between the two, correct?

The scale of this was preventable if we could’ve just for one moment set aside the politics. I don’t know why it has to be compared to anything or anyone...always gotta be the whatabouts never about actually leading the planet in doing the right thing. 

     I suppose my point is, when the truth surfaces, which by the way it is as we type words on this message board, this outbreak being the result of a catastrophe in a Chinese bio lab, rather than a bowl of soup in a wet market, and the subsequent cover up which involved the murder of scientists and journalists, as well as the destruction of life saving data and evidence, it will have far reaching implications, not only on future political dynamics, but an unprecedented exposure of the corruption within the establishment media.

     It's a difficult time and nerves are frayed...for what it's worth I know you're a good person and I applaud and appreciate your efforts on the front lines of this crisis, I also appreciate the civil discussion.

     With that I'll bid you adieu, I'm going outside and get some much needed vitamin E.

     Enjoy the day, it is a gift!

Trump will always do what is best for Trump and being in bed with China is best for Trump. This ad says it best

https://twitter.com/American_Bridge/status/1251180872939835393?s=20

He bid adieu before answering the question on why I should vote for Trump. Here's another reason not to:

https://digg.com/2018/trump-john-barron-recordings

The man has issues. 

Pro-Trump Protesters Escaped From Koch Industries Lab, Experts Believe

- Andy Borowitz

We’re the ones that gave the great response.

I’d rate it a 10.

We’ve done a fantastic job.

I think they should be appreciative.

Gallup just gave us the highest rating.

The highest on record.