Coalition to Stop Gun Violence Executive Director Josh Horwitz issued the following statement:
“We just did this.
“We went through the worst mass shooting in modern American history just over a month ago. Politicians offered their “thoughts and prayers” tweets. Our President gave his usual inadequate response. Cable news ran their set “mass shooting” graphics and asked the same rhetorical questions. Americans once again asked ‘how does this keep happening?’
“Dozens of people are dead in Texas today. We cannot allow them to be forgotten! This uniquely American cycle must stop. Americans are slain in their houses of prayer and all their elected officials will offer is prayer. We must do more.
“Our politicians can only remove this perpetual shame on our nation through immediate and purposeful action.
"Kelley, 26, was a resident of New Braunfels, a suburb of San Antonio, according to public records. Kelley was married and his mother-in-law listed a P.O. box in Sutherland Springs as a mailing address. San Antonio police reportedly raided Kelley's home on Sunday evening. A LinkedIn account appearing to belong to Kelley describes him as serving in the U.S. Air Force from his 2009 high-school graduation until 2013, after which he briefly taught at a summer Bible school."
This one has the additional twist that the fabled "good guy with a gun" appeared and cut the rampage short. Cold comfort for the folks already shot, but I am sure that will be thrown into the spin.
It's like some bad Spaghetti Western flick. Military guy gets dishonorable discharge for abusing wife and kids, then becomes a recluse. Rides his horse down to the church and takes out his aggressions. The neighbor returns gunfire. Bad guy hops on his horse and rides away. Posse chases him down, and crazy guy kills himself.
And thank god for guns, because if the guy with a gun hadn't been seen by another gun owner as he left the scene of the massacre, he might have gone to more churches and slaughtered those congregations too.
There are apparently no police officers in the town that would have responded to 26 people being slaughtered in a church.
^^^ too much snark, I and everyone else owe a thank you to the the neighbor that grabbed his rifle and engaged the "mentally disturbed" owner of the "bad bitch". That neighbor may have saved a lot of lives.
“He came with his [gun], and he took cover behind a car and he shot the guy–I’m not sure if it was inside the church as he was coming out–but if it wasn’t for him the guy wouldn’t have stopped,” he said. “And that’s when [the suspect] got in his vehicle and took off, and our friend shot through the window again trying to get him"
Perhaps the guy only shot himself after being wounded, realizing his spree couldn't continue.
Regardless, it doesn't change the point Nancy makes in the post above me. (although i always question the definition of "assault weapon").
>> Time for sensible gun legislation, better background checks, mental health care and banning assault weapons.
It was already illegal for him to buy the gun apparently. (It is not surprising the someone that is willing to shoot people would ignore the law though.)
We should probably fix the enforcement of the existing law before we unnecessarily pass more.
The gunman in Sunday’s mass shooting at a church in rural Texas was not legally eligible to buy firearms and had been denied a state gun permit, Gov. Greg Abbott (R) said Monday.
“Current law, as it exists right now, should have prevented him from being able to get a gun,” Abbott told “CBS This Morning.”
“I can tell you that before he made this purchase, he tried to get a gun permit in the state of Texas and was denied that permit.”
Since the enforcement of this law had been in effective: 'good guys' selling guns to whoever has the $$; the only sensible solution would be to stop manufacturing these weapons. Slow it down.. SOMETHING
The original propaganda was that he was an Antifa member --- please let's be honest about the whole Antifa thing…
Other than being useful for right wing propaganda -- as the left is not assuming or pointing fingers -- let's consider him a mentally ill person that should not have been able to buy an assault rifle.
The gruesome Texas church shooting arose from a “domestic situation” between guman Devin Kelley and his family, officials said Monday.
Kelley had even sent “threatening texts” to his mother-in-law, who attended the First Baptist Church in Sutherland Springs, where he killed 26 people Sunday.
“This was not racially motivated. It wasn't over religious beliefs,” Freeman Martin of the Texas Department of Public Safety told reporters. “There was a domestic situation going on with the family and in-laws.”
Sounds like the shooter was shot by the locals. He called his dad on his phone during the chase out of town where he said he didn't think he was going to make it. Probably offed himself to avoid passing out and being arrested.
Sounds like that final scene in Hell or High Water where the main characters attempt to rob a bank in a small time Texas town and get chased out of town by armed locals.
the unlawful use of violence and intimidation, esp for political aims <<<
Whatever his reason(s), he terrorized all of the people in the church. For a splinter of a second or til now, through these minutes and hours after the event, they are terrorized. He was a terrorist.
Oh Judit you have a more disciplined mind than that. Tons of things can cause terror--extreme DUI, domestic violence, sexual assault, armed robbery. Are all of those terrorist acts? What about creepy serial killers? Are they terrorists?
Different jurisdictions have different legal definitions, but in general it turns on motive. Generally political or ideological. Many terrorists are also mass murderers, but not necessarily if a bunch of people don't die. On the other hand, not every mass murderer is a terrorist. So far, it looks like his motives had to do with his wife's family. That's murder, I don't see terrorism here (again, based on what we know so far). Not that it matters that much, though sometimes it does. But the fact that it is offensive that every murderous act my a muslim is considered terrorism and Dylan Roof's murders were not doesn't make this terrorism.
I'm all for having the conversation about guns. Pretty cool about the good guy with the gun who went after him though. Fuck yeah dude. I am also OK with armed security volunteers in churches. I recently went to an African American church and they were NO WAY going to let me keep my backpack. Sucks that it has come to that. But there are just waaaaaay too many guns out there. Guns cause more problems than they solve.
26 people dead but it's cool the good guy that tried didn't get shot by police or killed in a high speed car accident.
Calling this guy a terrorist is too harsh. He just needed mental health treatment and another chance to terrorize or reconcile with his spouse's family.
>>it was already illegal for him to buy the gun apparently. (It is not surprising the someone that is willing to shoot people would ignore the law though)
He walked into a gun shop near San Antonio and purchased the assault weapon - used in the mass murder - last year.
FUCK THE NRA and folks who defend their agenda.
FUCK the GOP and all legislators who do nothing buy offer prayers.
if the air force had reported him correctly as a domestic abuser he wouldn't have been able to legally purchase the gun. the laws would have worked. another government bureaucratic blunder by the people you put faith in to keep you safe.
I have Asperger's Syndrome & lots of folks think I shouldn't be allowed to own guns. Then I get asked "Why haven't you sought an official diagnosis?" Yeah, riiiiiigggghhhhttttttt . . . just like I won't sign up for the Medical Schmee either . . .
& no, there's no "Cure" for Asperger's, so "Mental Health" services aren't of any consequence/help . . .
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: good at drinking water
white people aren't
white people aren't terrorists.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Hitchhiker awaiting "true call"
Funny
Funny
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: That’s Nancy with the laughin’ face
Guns don't kill people.
Guns don't kill people.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Bucky Badger
Why isn’t anyone talking
Why isn’t anyone talking about the second and third shooter? Once again the police and the MSM with their lies.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: That’s Nancy with the laughin’ face
Coalition to Stop Gun
Coalition to Stop Gun Violence Executive Director Josh Horwitz issued the following statement:
“We just did this.
“We went through the worst mass shooting in modern American history just over a month ago. Politicians offered their “thoughts and prayers” tweets. Our President gave his usual inadequate response. Cable news ran their set “mass shooting” graphics and asked the same rhetorical questions. Americans once again asked ‘how does this keep happening?’
“Dozens of people are dead in Texas today. We cannot allow them to be forgotten! This uniquely American cycle must stop. Americans are slain in their houses of prayer and all their elected officials will offer is prayer. We must do more.
“Our politicians can only remove this perpetual shame on our nation through immediate and purposeful action.
“We just did this.”
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: fishcane
wonder if he will achieve
wonder if he will achieve "animal" status
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: fishcane
Devin Patrick Kelley, 26
Devin Patrick Kelley, 26
https://www.thedailybeast.com/devin-patrick-kelley-idd-as-sutherland-spr...
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: smiley
Last shooting, the
Last shooting, the republicans made it easier for the mentally ill to get guns.
Can't wait to see what they do for this one.
God bless Texas.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: That’s Nancy with the laughin’ face
Arm the Preachers.
Arm the Preachers.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: smiley
That sounds like a Tarantino
That sounds like a Tarantino flick.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: MarkD
"Kelley, 26, was a resident
"Kelley, 26, was a resident of New Braunfels, a suburb of San Antonio, according to public records. Kelley was married and his mother-in-law listed a P.O. box in Sutherland Springs as a mailing address. San Antonio police reportedly raided Kelley's home on Sunday evening. A LinkedIn account appearing to belong to Kelley describes him as serving in the U.S. Air Force from his 2009 high-school graduation until 2013, after which he briefly taught at a summer Bible school."
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: That’s Nancy with the laughin’ face
In other words, the terrorist
In other words, the terrorist is a state trained Christian extremist..with easy access to assault weapon and ammo
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Thumbkinetic
Must these ammosexuals
Must these ammosexuals constantly push their agenda?
Who would Jesus shoot?
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: good at drinking water
http://nymag.com/daily
http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2017/11/multiple-people-dead-after-...
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Bucky Badger
vanilla Isis at it again
vanilla Isis at it again
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Frank3
thoughts & prayers with texas
thoughts & prayers with texas
our country has to get its head on & shit together. these events are too frequent ..sad
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Ken D.
This one has the additional
This one has the additional twist that the fabled "good guy with a gun" appeared and cut the rampage short. Cold comfort for the folks already shot, but I am sure that will be thrown into the spin.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: smiley
<<<Last shooting, the
<<<Last shooting, the republicans made it easier for the mentally ill to get guns
And like clockwork, Trump, without irony, says this shooting is a mental health issue, not a gun issue.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Briank
It's like some bad Spaghetti
It's like some bad Spaghetti Western flick. Military guy gets dishonorable discharge for abusing wife and kids, then becomes a recluse. Rides his horse down to the church and takes out his aggressions. The neighbor returns gunfire. Bad guy hops on his horse and rides away. Posse chases him down, and crazy guy kills himself.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: cb
"This isn't a guns situation"
"This isn't a guns situation"
- Trump
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Lucky Day
>>>>>this shooting is a
>>>>>this shooting is a mental health issue, not a gun issue.
its both
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: smiley
yes. absolutely.
yes. absolutely.
like all complicated things, it's a mix.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Hitchhiker awaiting "true call"
You can take my gun when you
You can take my gun when you pry it from my cold dead hands
proof of every deranged gun owner
those who voluntarily give up their guns might be deemed fit later on
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: good at drinking water
So he's white.
So he's white.
No terrorist.
And thank god for guns, because if the guy with a gun hadn't been seen by another gun owner as he left the scene of the massacre, he might have gone to more churches and slaughtered those congregations too.
There are apparently no police officers in the town that would have responded to 26 people being slaughtered in a church.
^^^ too much snark, I and everyone else owe a thank you to the the neighbor that grabbed his rifle and engaged the "mentally disturbed" owner of the "bad bitch". That neighbor may have saved a lot of lives.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: That’s Nancy with the laughin’ face
Pray that Trump starts
Pray that Trump starts attending Church
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: That’s Nancy with the laughin’ face
those 'good guys with the
those 'good guys with the guns' still were unable to Kill the bad guy.
Yes, they're heroes for chasing him and trying. bad guy shot himself.
Time for sensible gun legislation, better background checks, mental health care and banning assault weapons.
Instead the GOP and NRA will offer more 'thoughts and prayers'
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: smiley
We seem to be getting
We seem to be getting conflicting reports.
http://dailycaller.com/2017/11/05/eyewitness-watched-neighbor-shoot-the-...
“He came with his [gun], and he took cover behind a car and he shot the guy–I’m not sure if it was inside the church as he was coming out–but if it wasn’t for him the guy wouldn’t have stopped,” he said. “And that’s when [the suspect] got in his vehicle and took off, and our friend shot through the window again trying to get him"
Perhaps the guy only shot himself after being wounded, realizing his spree couldn't continue.
Regardless, it doesn't change the point Nancy makes in the post above me. (although i always question the definition of "assault weapon").
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: That’s Nancy with the laughin’ face
Texas Governor blames 'evil'
Texas Governor blames 'evil' and the only solution to gun violence is prayers and getting closer to GOD.
TEXAS is so fucked as is the rest of America
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: aiq
Stop worrying, libtards.
Stop worrying, libtards. Speaker Ryan has sent thoughts and prayers.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: _
>> Time for sensible gun
>> Time for sensible gun legislation, better background checks, mental health care and banning assault weapons.
It was already illegal for him to buy the gun apparently. (It is not surprising the someone that is willing to shoot people would ignore the law though.)
We should probably fix the enforcement of the existing law before we unnecessarily pass more.
The gunman in Sunday’s mass shooting at a church in rural Texas was not legally eligible to buy firearms and had been denied a state gun permit, Gov. Greg Abbott (R) said Monday.
“Current law, as it exists right now, should have prevented him from being able to get a gun,” Abbott told “CBS This Morning.”
“I can tell you that before he made this purchase, he tried to get a gun permit in the state of Texas and was denied that permit.”
http://thehill.com/homenews/house/358942-texas-gov-abbot-gunman-was-deni...
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: jonaspond
Good guy with gun did not
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: jonaspond
Since the enforcement of this
Since the enforcement of this law had been in effective: 'good guys' selling guns to whoever has the $$; the only sensible solution would be to stop manufacturing these weapons. Slow it down.. SOMETHING
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Johnny D
^Yup
^Yup
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Alias
Terrorist? No. Sounds like
Terrorist? No. Sounds like he did it because he was pissed at his in laws. Mass murderer, but not terrorist, at least with what we know so far.
Not like that's something to be proud of.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: thinthread
didn't know that someone who
didn't know that someone who thought people that believed in god were stupid was considered christian but whatever
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Hitchhiker awaiting "true call"
I don't know why he isn't a
I don't know why he isn't a terrorist.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: jonaspond
BOTB - define terrorist?
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: thinthread
He was called "a state
He was called "a state trained Christian extremist". Seemed odd for an atheist
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Lucky Day
ter·ror·ism
ter·ror·ism
ˈterəˌrizəm/
noun
the unlawful use of violence and intimidation, esp for political aims
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Lucky Day
>>>>>He was called "a state
>>>>>He was called "a state trained Christian extremist". Seemed odd for an atheist
Almost as odd as a Sunday School teacher being an Atheist.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: jonaspond
The original propaganda was
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Thumbkinetic
The Air Force itself is
The Air Force itself is pretty Christian extremist.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: _
>> the unlawful use of
>> the unlawful use of violence and intimidation, esp for political aims
So what was his "political aim", then?
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: charmskooldropout
And again we know more about
And again we know more about this guy in one day than we know about Paddock. weird
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Hitchhiker awaiting "true call"
He believed in the right to
He believed in the right to own guns?
He thought he could prove that more relaxed gun laws and more armed people might be safer?
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: _
Clearly wasn't terrorism:
Clearly wasn't terrorism:
The gruesome Texas church shooting arose from a “domestic situation” between guman Devin Kelley and his family, officials said Monday.
Kelley had even sent “threatening texts” to his mother-in-law, who attended the First Baptist Church in Sutherland Springs, where he killed 26 people Sunday.
“This was not racially motivated. It wasn't over religious beliefs,” Freeman Martin of the Texas Department of Public Safety told reporters. “There was a domestic situation going on with the family and in-laws.”
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/texas-gunman-devin-kelley-in-la...
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Hitchhiker awaiting "true call"
What if his family told him
What if his family told him it wasn't legal for him to own firearms because of his past actions.
So he made a move before his weapons were taken away.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Ken D.
Sounds like the shooter was
Sounds like the shooter was shot by the locals. He called his dad on his phone during the chase out of town where he said he didn't think he was going to make it. Probably offed himself to avoid passing out and being arrested.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2017/11/06/investigat...
Sounds like that final scene in Hell or High Water where the main characters attempt to rob a bank in a small time Texas town and get chased out of town by armed locals.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: treat island
>>> ter·ror·ism
>>> ter·ror·ism
ˈterəˌrizəm/
noun
the unlawful use of violence and intimidation, esp for political aims <<<
Whatever his reason(s), he terrorized all of the people in the church. For a splinter of a second or til now, through these minutes and hours after the event, they are terrorized. He was a terrorist.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Alias
Oh Judit you have a more
Oh Judit you have a more disciplined mind than that. Tons of things can cause terror--extreme DUI, domestic violence, sexual assault, armed robbery. Are all of those terrorist acts? What about creepy serial killers? Are they terrorists?
Different jurisdictions have different legal definitions, but in general it turns on motive. Generally political or ideological. Many terrorists are also mass murderers, but not necessarily if a bunch of people don't die. On the other hand, not every mass murderer is a terrorist. So far, it looks like his motives had to do with his wife's family. That's murder, I don't see terrorism here (again, based on what we know so far). Not that it matters that much, though sometimes it does. But the fact that it is offensive that every murderous act my a muslim is considered terrorism and Dylan Roof's murders were not doesn't make this terrorism.
I'm all for having the conversation about guns. Pretty cool about the good guy with the gun who went after him though. Fuck yeah dude. I am also OK with armed security volunteers in churches. I recently went to an African American church and they were NO WAY going to let me keep my backpack. Sucks that it has come to that. But there are just waaaaaay too many guns out there. Guns cause more problems than they solve.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: thinthread
he wasn't a Sunday school
he wasn't a Sunday school teacher
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Lucky Day
Sorry. Bible studies teacher
Sorry. Bible studies teacher
A LinkedIn account reveals Kelley, who was married, was an Air Force veteran and ex-Bible studies teacher
www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5052163/amp/Up-27-shot-Texas-church-gun...
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: That’s Nancy with the laughin’ face
An atheist bible study
An atheist bible study teacher, right?
Jesus Christ, Hillman is getting his talking points from Alex Jones again.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Alias
Stands to reason that he
Stands to reason that he could have taught bible study and then later decided he's an atheist.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: jonaspond
Hounder --- instead of
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Sideshow Bob
Didn't take long for InfoWars
Didn't take long for InfoWars to chime in:
http://www.newsweek.com/sutherland-springs-shooter-devin-patrick-kelley-...
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Hitchhiker awaiting "true call"
26 people dead but it's cool
26 people dead but it's cool the good guy that tried didn't get shot by police or killed in a high speed car accident.
Calling this guy a terrorist is too harsh. He just needed mental health treatment and another chance to terrorize or reconcile with his spouse's family.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: That’s Nancy with the laughin’ face
>>it was already illegal for
>>it was already illegal for him to buy the gun apparently. (It is not surprising the someone that is willing to shoot people would ignore the law though)
He walked into a gun shop near San Antonio and purchased the assault weapon - used in the mass murder - last year.
FUCK THE NRA and folks who defend their agenda.
FUCK the GOP and all legislators who do nothing buy offer prayers.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: thinthread
if the air force had reported
if the air force had reported him correctly as a domestic abuser he wouldn't have been able to legally purchase the gun. the laws would have worked. another government bureaucratic blunder by the people you put faith in to keep you safe.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: _
>> He walked into a gun shop
>> He walked into a gun shop near San Antonio and purchased the assault weapon - used in the mass murder - last year.
>> FUCK the GOP and all legislators who do nothing buy offer prayers.
Blame the Air Force, not the legislature. We already have a background check mechanism that should have prevented this tragedy.
Air Force Error Allowed Texas Gunman to Buy Weapons
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: That’s Nancy with the laughin’ face
Shoulda, Woulda, Coulda..but
Shoulda, Woulda, Coulda..but didn't.
Time to start from scratch. Better and more stringent legislation (and enforecment) is needed.
Bump stock and Assault weapons BAN now.
Nobody should be allowed to buy these mass murder machines. Domestic abuser or not.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: That’s Nancy with the laughin’ face
>“I can tell you that before
>“I can tell you that before he made this purchase, he tried to get a gun permit in the state of Texas and was denied that permit.”
Texas law requires a license to carry a concealed handgun, but rifles and shotguns may be carried openly without a license<<
http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2017/11/texas-gunman-bought-assault-...
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Sideshow Bob
I have Asperger's Syndrome &
I have Asperger's Syndrome & lots of folks think I shouldn't be allowed to own guns. Then I get asked "Why haven't you sought an official diagnosis?" Yeah, riiiiiigggghhhhttttttt . . . just like I won't sign up for the Medical Schmee either . . .
& no, there's no "Cure" for Asperger's, so "Mental Health" services aren't of any consequence/help . . .