Liberals aren't for "open borders," but it's worth noting that the last president to push for (and get) legalization of and amnesty for illegal immigrants already in the U.S. was Ronald Reagan.
Speaking of Reagan, found this statue of ole Ronnie in a park in Budapest. Apparently, it went up after the fall of Communism when all the statues of Stalin & Co. went down and we're hauled to a property on the outskirts of town. Ironically, the current government of Hungary under the rule of Trump like nationalist Viktor Orban has fortified it's southern border against migrants from the Middle East and Africa and has some of the most draconian anti-immigration policies of all of Europe.
Watch the news lately? There have been constant marches demanding we abolish borders. Even the msm's new socialist golden girl has been pushing for it. I seem to remember signs just the other day in NYC demanding we abolish borders, ice, profits, prisons and so on. This has nothing to do with Trump's "lies".
I watch the news, listen to the news, read the news.
People are calling for open borders is like the left wants to take away your guns. Abolish ICE? Used to be called the Immigration and Naturalization Service, Border Patrol, US custom service... If ICE is eliminated, something will take its place.
>>>Watch the news lately? There have been constant marches demanding we abolish borders.
i haven’t seen that, but since they are happening constantly, please post some video of marches in the United States where people are demanding that we abolish borders.
Anyone please feel free to post articles, videos, websites regarding these marches. Thanks.
>>>>>Watch the news lately? There have been constant marches demanding we abolish borders. Even the msm's new socialist golden girl has been pushing for it. I seem to remember signs just the other day in NYC demanding we abolish borders, ice, profits, prisons and so on. This has nothing to do with Trump's "lies"
Thanks Aesop!
More like fox news propaganda watching is a mental disorder.
>>>>> marches in the United States where people are demanding that we abolish borders.
The ICE building in Portland where there was some very big protests recently is only a few blocks from my office and the place was littered with signs calling for the abolishment of ICE and have a specific recollection of seeing a sign saying "No Borders." Its hyperbole, of course.
I also recall that John Lennon sang something about imaging a world without guarded borders. Concept is not new.
Lumber, Not at all I think we all know he lies pretty often. The quote was in response to the comments above saying Trump is the only one saying this when clearly there is a growing segment that wants open borders and has publicly pushed for it.
Edit: Frankly I think this kinda stuff only puts more fuel on the fire. There is no way the US will ever abolish borders, prisons and the like. That kinda stuff is pretty much on the fringe.
Woobs, abolishing ICE and open borders are two very different things.
As i wrote, if ICE is abolished another agency will perform the same functions. Remember ICE didn't exist until 2003, prior to that its functions were performed by Immigration and Naturalization Service, the customs service, the border patrol etc.
Concerning open borders...
The Times also noted that all 193 House Democrats have signed onto a proposal that “enhances technology used to monitor the border, and provides $110 million in grants annually for collaboration between local law enforcement and Border Patrol agents.”
Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, the young Democrat who identifies as a socialist and stunned the Democratic establishment Tuesday when she upset veteran New York Rep. Joe Crowley in a congressional primary, flatly denied in an interview with NPR on Wednesday the oft-printed accusation that she is for open borders.
“We have to have a secure border,” she told host Steve Inskeep. “We need to make sure that people are, in fact, documented.”
We care about protecting our country, but we don’t think we need to protect the border by putting children in cages,” Ms. Pelosi said. “We want to be smart and strong — not reckless, rash and ruthless in this case.”
Thirty Democrats in the House have sponsored a bipartisan immigration bill this year that gives the young undocumented immigrants known as Dreamers a pathway to citizenship. It also enhances technology used to monitor the border, and provides $110 million in grants annually for collaboration between local law enforcement and Border Patrol agents.
All 193 Democrats in the House and 23 moderate Republicans have signed a “discharge” petition to force a vote on that bill and other immigration proposals.
In the Senate, all but one Democrat voted for similar immigration legislation sponsored by Senator John McCain, Republican of Arizona, and Senator Chris Coons, Democrat of Delaware.
And all but three Democrats voted for yet another bipartisan proposal to provide a pathway to citizenship to Dreamers, authorize $25 billion to build barriers and hire personnel at the border over the next decade. It would also prohibit green-card holders from sponsoring adult children.
Democrats also consistently supported border security measures before Mr. Trump took office.
In 2013, every single Democrat in the Senate voted for the so-called Gang of Eight immigration overhaul bill that would have provided about $40 billion for border enforcement, including deploying thousands more agents and building 700 miles of fencing. (The House never voted on the bill.)
And in 2006, 26 Senate Democrats voted to build 700 miles of walls and fences on the southwestern border. Mr. Schumer was among the Democrats who supported that proposal — a fact that even Mr. Trump has repeatedly acknowledged, as recently as last week.
When it comes to open borders , Woobs, I'd say you were spot on when you wrote...
Lumber, Notice I did not lump the dems in with Cortez and the DSA or at least the vast majority of them anyways. My view is that once she was elected and it became known that her party the DSA was openly advocating for open borders and not just abolishing ICE many dems were tripping over themselves (with the media's help) to gain distance from such fringe positions. Immediately after she won many were making statements as you have pointed out above against the idea none of that is in dispute. In her case its my belief but of course I could be wrong that it is what she is or was for until the dems who's support she would absolutely have to have to win in the the general put a squash on it and rightfully so. Now maybe if I was able to find some statements from before the primary where she was publicly going against her own party's position on open borders I would more willing to trust what she now says. Until then I look at it as politics as usual which means I trust no one.
When It comes to equating abolishing ICE with open borders please don't lump me into that group I have made no such claim as Trump and others indeed have. That's really not what I am talking about here. Whatever Trump does or does not lie about does not change the fact that the DSA is advocating for these positions and Cortez is pretty much their defacto leader at this moment in time. As you can see in the image I posted above which was posted by the DSA they have pre-printed signs for open borders and publicly state we should also abolish prisons and profit among other things which will never happen and only fans the flames of division that is making rational thought and conversation near impossible at a level that in my short 43 years I have never experienced.
Thanks for having a reasonable discussion without name calling it's pretty refreshing. I am off to work. Cheers.
Ah the Greens I still get shit for voting for Nader. But as far as relevance I think the greens have no one in federal office where as the DSA has the new golden girl in Cortez. Just the other day the DNC chair said she was the future of the party as well as many other dems even as they try to distance themselves from the far left ideas of abolishing ice, borders, profits etc that they suggest. Their numbers are growing and they are getting very favorable media attention of late. None of that means I don't agree with some of the stuff the greens or the DSA are advocating though. Just no quite so extreme. I think the polls show the general feeling about issues like this and here is a good link to a few of them from the past few days that show that a more moderate approach is what the voters in general are looking for. To each their own of course but I just don't think bashing Trump over every tiny thing and going way far to the left has or will work surprisingly he's got fairly good support on many issues from a diverse section of the county despise the 24/7 negative coverage. It could even be bolstering his position. Seems just a few months ago there was huge blue wave coming what happened to that?
Woobs, the Greens hold several state and local seats, the DSA has a candidate running for a federal seat. The Greens are not relevant nationally, and one candidate running for a congressional seat does not make the DSA the new face of the democratic party.
>Seems just a few months ago there was huge blue wave coming what happened to that?<
No coherent strategy or message.
Like Will Rogers said...
"I am not a member of any organized political party. I am a Democrat."
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: nebulous nelly
Who is calling for open
Who is calling for open borders? That's just another Trump lie.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Old Fart Message Board
Has anybody been following
Has anybody been following the borders in europe? A lot less lenient than we are
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: You know better....
OPEN BORDERS YEA GREAT IDEA
OPEN BORDERS YEA GREAT IDEA "LIBERALISM IS A MENTAL DISORDER "
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Bucky Badger
I’m cool with borders I’d
I’m cool with borders I’d like to remove all boundaries though
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Ken D.
Worked out great for the
Worked out great for the Indians.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: nebulous nelly
Dumb enough to believe Trump
Dumb enough to believe Trump's lies
1. Dan
2. You Know (Nothing)
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Chancellor
Liberals aren't for "open
Liberals aren't for "open borders," but it's worth noting that the last president to push for (and get) legalization of and amnesty for illegal immigrants already in the U.S. was Ronald Reagan.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Thumbkinetic
Can RR's sainthood be
Can RR's GOP sainthood be impeached?
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: smiley
Holy shit.
Holy shit.
Helloooo Chancellor. Great to see ya man!
Been thinking weve needed ya around here on more than one occasion.
Hope all is well on your end and that the famiky is thriving.
Cheers.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Ken D.
Speaking of Reagan, found
Speaking of Reagan, found this statue of ole Ronnie in a park in Budapest. Apparently, it went up after the fall of Communism when all the statues of Stalin & Co. went down and we're hauled to a property on the outskirts of town. Ironically, the current government of Hungary under the rule of Trump like nationalist Viktor Orban has fortified it's southern border against migrants from the Middle East and Africa and has some of the most draconian anti-immigration policies of all of Europe.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Dan
....
....
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: nebulous nelly
Dan, please tell me who is
Dan, please tell me who is calling for open(unregulated) borders? The only time i hear about it is when Trump and his political allies lie about it.
Dan, who was referred to as "The Deporter in Chief"
Are you saying that you are dumb enough to believe Trump's lies?
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: El Chavo
Watch the news lately? There
Watch the news lately? There have been constant marches demanding we abolish borders. Even the msm's new socialist golden girl has been pushing for it. I seem to remember signs just the other day in NYC demanding we abolish borders, ice, profits, prisons and so on. This has nothing to do with Trump's "lies".
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: nebulous nelly
I watch the news, listen to
I watch the news, listen to the news, read the news.
People are calling for open borders is like the left wants to take away your guns. Abolish ICE? Used to be called the Immigration and Naturalization Service, Border Patrol, US custom service... If ICE is eliminated, something will take its place.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Bucky Badger
>>>Watch the news lately?
>>>Watch the news lately? There have been constant marches demanding we abolish borders.
i haven’t seen that, but since they are happening constantly, please post some video of marches in the United States where people are demanding that we abolish borders.
Anyone please feel free to post articles, videos, websites regarding these marches. Thanks.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Hitchhiker awaiting "true call"
Dan, you're a racist pig.
Dan, you're a racist pig.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Oaksterdam Dan
>>>>>Watch the news lately?
>>>>>Watch the news lately? There have been constant marches demanding we abolish borders. Even the msm's new socialist golden girl has been pushing for it. I seem to remember signs just the other day in NYC demanding we abolish borders, ice, profits, prisons and so on. This has nothing to do with Trump's "lies"
Thanks Aesop!
More like fox news propaganda watching is a mental disorder.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Ken D.
>>>>> marches in the United
>>>>> marches in the United States where people are demanding that we abolish borders.
The ICE building in Portland where there was some very big protests recently is only a few blocks from my office and the place was littered with signs calling for the abolishment of ICE and have a specific recollection of seeing a sign saying "No Borders." Its hyperbole, of course.
I also recall that John Lennon sang something about imaging a world without guarded borders. Concept is not new.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: nebulous nelly
Woobs, why did you put lies
Woobs, why did you put lies in quotations?
Are you suggesting that Trump doesn't lie?
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: El Chavo
Lumber, Not at all I think we
Lumber, Not at all I think we all know he lies pretty often. The quote was in response to the comments above saying Trump is the only one saying this when clearly there is a growing segment that wants open borders and has publicly pushed for it.
Edit: Frankly I think this kinda stuff only puts more fuel on the fire. There is no way the US will ever abolish borders, prisons and the like. That kinda stuff is pretty much on the fringe.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Def. High
If you want different rules
If you want different rules than Shitholistan, you have to have a different country.
Can't have a country without controlled borders.
Borders should be controlled as humanely as possible.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Bucky Badger
Everyone keep their eyes
Everyone keep their eyes peeled, Savoir-Faire is everywhere. And of course the little thief is French-Canadian.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: El Chavo
As requested.
As requested.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Bluelight
>>Can't have a country
Borders, hand-cuffs & shackles are over rated; we acn not let the reasons for the freedoms we've inherited are diluted.
There would be no "America" as we know it; if that "belief" was its foundation.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Bluelight
acn = can- you knew what I
acn = can- you knew what I meant?
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: nebulous nelly
Woobs, abolishing ICE and
Woobs, abolishing ICE and open borders are two very different things.
As i wrote, if ICE is abolished another agency will perform the same functions. Remember ICE didn't exist until 2003, prior to that its functions were performed by Immigration and Naturalization Service, the customs service, the border patrol etc.
Concerning open borders...
The Times also noted that all 193 House Democrats have signed onto a proposal that “enhances technology used to monitor the border, and provides $110 million in grants annually for collaboration between local law enforcement and Border Patrol agents.”
Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, the young Democrat who identifies as a socialist and stunned the Democratic establishment Tuesday when she upset veteran New York Rep. Joe Crowley in a congressional primary, flatly denied in an interview with NPR on Wednesday the oft-printed accusation that she is for open borders.
“We have to have a secure border,” she told host Steve Inskeep. “We need to make sure that people are, in fact, documented.”
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/opinion/zorn/ct-perspec-zorn-open-bor...
We care about protecting our country, but we don’t think we need to protect the border by putting children in cages,” Ms. Pelosi said. “We want to be smart and strong — not reckless, rash and ruthless in this case.”
Thirty Democrats in the House have sponsored a bipartisan immigration bill this year that gives the young undocumented immigrants known as Dreamers a pathway to citizenship. It also enhances technology used to monitor the border, and provides $110 million in grants annually for collaboration between local law enforcement and Border Patrol agents.
All 193 Democrats in the House and 23 moderate Republicans have signed a “discharge” petition to force a vote on that bill and other immigration proposals.
In the Senate, all but one Democrat voted for similar immigration legislation sponsored by Senator John McCain, Republican of Arizona, and Senator Chris Coons, Democrat of Delaware.
And all but three Democrats voted for yet another bipartisan proposal to provide a pathway to citizenship to Dreamers, authorize $25 billion to build barriers and hire personnel at the border over the next decade. It would also prohibit green-card holders from sponsoring adult children.
Democrats also consistently supported border security measures before Mr. Trump took office.
In 2013, every single Democrat in the Senate voted for the so-called Gang of Eight immigration overhaul bill that would have provided about $40 billion for border enforcement, including deploying thousands more agents and building 700 miles of fencing. (The House never voted on the bill.)
And in 2006, 26 Senate Democrats voted to build 700 miles of walls and fences on the southwestern border. Mr. Schumer was among the Democrats who supported that proposal — a fact that even Mr. Trump has repeatedly acknowledged, as recently as last week.
When it comes to open borders , Woobs, I'd say you were spot on when you wrote...
"That kinda stuff is pretty much on the fringe."
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: nebulous nelly
Forgot to include link for
Forgot to include link for the above NY Times article...
We care about protecting our country...
https://mobile.nytimes.com/2018/06/27/us/politics/fast-check-donald-trum...
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: El Chavo
Lumber, Notice I did not lump
Lumber, Notice I did not lump the dems in with Cortez and the DSA or at least the vast majority of them anyways. My view is that once she was elected and it became known that her party the DSA was openly advocating for open borders and not just abolishing ICE many dems were tripping over themselves (with the media's help) to gain distance from such fringe positions. Immediately after she won many were making statements as you have pointed out above against the idea none of that is in dispute. In her case its my belief but of course I could be wrong that it is what she is or was for until the dems who's support she would absolutely have to have to win in the the general put a squash on it and rightfully so. Now maybe if I was able to find some statements from before the primary where she was publicly going against her own party's position on open borders I would more willing to trust what she now says. Until then I look at it as politics as usual which means I trust no one.
When It comes to equating abolishing ICE with open borders please don't lump me into that group I have made no such claim as Trump and others indeed have. That's really not what I am talking about here. Whatever Trump does or does not lie about does not change the fact that the DSA is advocating for these positions and Cortez is pretty much their defacto leader at this moment in time. As you can see in the image I posted above which was posted by the DSA they have pre-printed signs for open borders and publicly state we should also abolish prisons and profit among other things which will never happen and only fans the flames of division that is making rational thought and conversation near impossible at a level that in my short 43 years I have never experienced.
Thanks for having a reasonable discussion without name calling it's pretty refreshing. I am off to work. Cheers.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: nebulous nelly
Woobs, the DSA? The DSA is
Woobs, the DSA? The DSA is 45000 members strong. Better off citing the greens and their immigration policy. But they are largely irrelevant too.
>Thanks for having a reasonable discussion without name calling it's pretty refreshing. I am off to work. Cheers.<
My pleasure. Enjoy the day.
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: El Chavo
Ah the Greens I still get
Ah the Greens I still get shit for voting for Nader. But as far as relevance I think the greens have no one in federal office where as the DSA has the new golden girl in Cortez. Just the other day the DNC chair said she was the future of the party as well as many other dems even as they try to distance themselves from the far left ideas of abolishing ice, borders, profits etc that they suggest. Their numbers are growing and they are getting very favorable media attention of late. None of that means I don't agree with some of the stuff the greens or the DSA are advocating though. Just no quite so extreme. I think the polls show the general feeling about issues like this and here is a good link to a few of them from the past few days that show that a more moderate approach is what the voters in general are looking for. To each their own of course but I just don't think bashing Trump over every tiny thing and going way far to the left has or will work surprisingly he's got fairly good support on many issues from a diverse section of the county despise the 24/7 negative coverage. It could even be bolstering his position. Seems just a few months ago there was huge blue wave coming what happened to that?
http://thehill.com/opinion/campaign/396483-socialist-agenda-will-prove-d...
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Oaksterdam Dan
^^^^opinion section of the
^^^^opinion section of the hill of course
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: nebulous nelly
Woobs, the Greens hold
Woobs, the Greens hold several state and local seats, the DSA has a candidate running for a federal seat. The Greens are not relevant nationally, and one candidate running for a congressional seat does not make the DSA the new face of the democratic party.
>Seems just a few months ago there was huge blue wave coming what happened to that?<
No coherent strategy or message.
Like Will Rogers said...
"I am not a member of any organized political party. I am a Democrat."
Top of Page Bottom of Page PermalinkFull Name: Dan
"
"opposer Knotesau on Tuesday, July 10, 2018 – 05:43 pm
Dan, you're a racist pig."
Please elaborate....
How does a worthless piece of trash loser, like yourself call a Hispanic like myself "RACIST PIG" based on 2 pics??????
lol