Vaccine Passports

Nazis.

Racket won't be allowed to attend Beachlife. 

Custie fest.

Bring it on.   Just got my second dose yesterday and I am ready for some shows!

Simple question. You need to fly somewhere and there are two airlines offering flights to where you're going. One airline offers a vaccine passport flight, where you know everyone on the flight is fully vaccinated, and the other takes all comers. All other things being equal, which flight are you taking? 
 

Get your damn vaccine and be prepared to prove it!

Simple answer is I never need to fly anywhere. I don't have a regular passport. 

Not all classes are the same. 

Knotesau, try science class - it's the only one that really matters in a pandemic.

Pandemic is over. 

New data from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention reported that California's seven-day case rate was 40.3 per 100,000 people. By comparison, last winter the state's average peaked at more than 40,000 new cases per day.

Pretty damn ignorant to think it's just about California, but you do you.

I cant wait for the implementation of vaccine passports, it should be a National thing but the right wingers will protest....

Vaccination records for travel is not a new thing 

Slacker, much like Racket,  is just trolling and really isn't so stupid as to actually  believe that the pandemic over.  Starved for attention?

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-51235105

>>>>>new data from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention reported that California's seven-day case rate was 40.3 per 100,000 people. By comparison, last winter the state's average peaked at more than 40,000 new cases per day.

There are about 40,000,000 people in California (39,984,261 at last count).   40.3 per 100,000 people equals 16,120.   Not sure exactly what "seven-day case rate" means, but if it is the average daily new number of cases over a seven-day period, that would mean the rates of new infections are 40% that of the peak (which was bad).    An improvement for sure, but still a lot of people coming down with the virus.

The national daily death rate is down to under 700 people per day, which is the lowest in a long time.   Last time it was this low was back in early October, well before the dramatic winter wave.   Old people, who accounted for a grossly disproportionate portion of the deaths to date, are now widely vaccinated and the vaccinated people who do get sick anyway are suffering lesser symptoms.  Its now the young people getting it and they tend to be more resilient.  While that is good news, we still have a ways to go.

In the meantime, let us old fuckers who have been vaccinated see some damn live music!

I'm out on vaccine passports and no I'm not a right winger.

Dave Matthews Band returns to The Gorge in Quincy, Washington for their annual Labor Day Weekend run September 3 – 5. Dumpstaphunk and Allen Stone open at The Gorge on September 3 with Robert Randolph & The Family Band kicking off the action on September 4 and Mavis Staples as support on September 5. September performances in Bend, Irvine (California), Milwaukee, Saratoga Springs (New York), Wantagh (New York), Holmdel (New Jersey), Cincinnati and Cuyahoga Falls (Ohio) follow.

> Vaccination records for travel is not a new thing

Nor is requiring vaccination documentation to enroll kids in public schools, I thought.

Do tell when you've needed vaccines to cross state lines.

I can't think of when we've needed proof of vaccines to cross state lines, but I believe that when I went to Mexico in 1966 we need proof of vaccines. Possibly other international travel, too?

I remember that some of the North East states were quarantining travelers from some other states last year, I wonder if they would let you travel freely with vaccines now?

Can we kick out the unvaccinated lower classes? California should only be for the elite. 

Awww, Slacker, seems like a better idea to vaccinate everyone who is open to it. Isn't it free in California? They are taking vaccine clinics to the people here, aren't they doing that there?

We got it. But not everyone wants to be like us. They should leave. 

https://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/local/south-bay/pop-up-sites-sit-empty-a...

Is it called a Koan?

How can you have a racket in your head

When your head is empty

slacker 

class is everything to you

Even though you have zero class

get a grip

The coordination efforts seem to be falling a little short. I like that they are going to transition to evening clinics - if people are lucky enough to have jobs it'll help.

I don't know about everyone being like you, but I hope the trend for vaccinating grows.

You have to wear a seatbelt

that must be unconstitutional

Do you dogs have vaccination licenses?

Hey LLTD, what's your deal?

Just a couple of light weight insults

Stemming from a difference of opinion and being struck by the presentation

I will take a break
from expressing my strong opinion

with a cynical presentation 

I meant to say "your dogs " which is the law where I live 

My vaccine card is about the easiest thing to doctor and photoshop. If that's all they want to see then it is very stupid seeing that a two year old could photoshop and doctor one. Overall, I'm not for vaccine passports.

If you're vaccinated and 95% protected, what do you care if your neighbor is vaccinated?  If you follow the science- as current orthodoxy states- children and healthy, lively young adults with no comorbiditeis are not at high risk or vulnerable to illness.  Should children and college students be required to vaccinate if they are not at risk?

Cases among the young are rising, and they often have symptoms which are more difficult to treat

>if you're vaccinated and 95% protected, what do you care if your neighbor is vaccinated<

I'm not a virologist, nor a public health expert,  but I believe the argument goes a bit like this...

Because in order to achieve herd immunity approximately 70% of the population should be vaccinated or have developed natural immunity.  If not, the virus will continue to have the opportunity to mutate and possibly develop more problematic variants. 

You still have the ability to not only get the virus but also to transmit it. ESP to those who aren't vaccinated yet, potentially making them sicker than you.What increases with vaccination is your bodies own ability to fight the virus, decreasing your chances of getting sicker, limiting deadly symptoms 

>  Should children and college students be required to vaccinate if they are not at risk?

only at schools that aren't ignorant about virology/science and schools that want to stop the Covid spread in their community and beyond.

might need to do some parent education in the community first, to address their questions  

>>>You still have the ability to not only get the virus but also to transmit it.

It's becoming increasingly more apparant that the vaccines don't protect as well against the variants and folks who are still vaccinated still have the potential to shed virus.

I'm still undecided on what I do personally- just chiming in with my perspective.  I'm 33 y/o with no comorbities, eat whole foods and veggies and exercise several times a week.  I got sick for a day- tested positive and then negative again a few days later.  My view is that if you are unvaccinated at this point going forward, well, that's on you.  If you get sick, you've accepted the risk that comes with it.  There's risk associated with everything in life.  If you want to get vaccinated- awesome.  I'm happy and elated for those who can go out and resume their lives.  Otherwise, live and let live.

This whole pandemic was a great opportunity to message the importance of your health and building a healthy, robust immune system.  I haven't heard anything from those in power or traditional media encouraging the use of vitamins, eating right and exercising.  This is a sidebar convo to the OP but worth noting.  I think it's unfortunate and was a big missed opportunity to message personal health and accountability.  

Certainly all of those things (healthy lifestyle) could help you recover from any virus - will it protect you from contracting a virus, prevent transmission to vulnerable populations or prevent death, the science says nope.
Roll the dice, bro and stay the duck away from those of us who are doing our part to protect ourselves and others. 

And plan on homeschooling the rugrats

Siobud, you are 100 percent correct. A healthy lifestyle and diet is by far the best defense against virus because it strengthens your immunity. The vaccine is an aid but if you are in poor health you are always at risk to viruses and illness. Many people have contracted Covid and their immunities whipped the shit out of it and you have the antibodies. It seems people are very focused on negatives right now instead of viable solutions.

Nancy, apparently you missed the information about how the vaccine does not help you prevent passing the virus if contracted. Aside from a N95 mask there is not much that does.

^wrong. your phone broken? try Google..

the vaccine does help slow transmission rates. 

Maybe you missed the part about the science confirming that   the MRNA vaccine significantly reduces transmission rates compared to those who are unvaccinated?

Specifically, the part about MRNA Covid vaccines being 90 percent effective at blocking infection - symptomatic and asymptotic? Even J & J is effective at reduction in transmission rates, just not as good as the MRNA vaccines
 

No vaccine is 100 percent effective at preventing infections, but the vaccine absolutely reduces the spread. And no shit, until more people are vaccinated, pandemic protocols are necessary

I thought I got my vaccine passport a couple of weeks ago from Mike. 

My view is that if you are unvaccinated at this point going forward, well, that's on you. 

This kind of thinking is the root of the issue. When it comes to public health, everyone is in it together. there isn't room for not being a team player. See: Polio. Measles etc. I have zero tolerance for the POV that this is a personal choice issue, it isn't for reasons that have been accurately stated.

 ^Exactly. Fuck the 'my view' from science ignorant narcissists spreading misinformation and conspiracies about the vaccine and the Covid pandemic. 

This pandemic is so dangerous that the dance floor has to be socially distanced. 

>>This kind of thinking is the root of the issue.

If you're concerned about catching Covid and getting significantly ill then you should absolutely take advantage of your opportunities to get vaccinated.  If you decide not to get vaccinated and get sick- that's on you.  I don't think that's too hot of a take, really.

You're missing the point, which is that if you decide not to get vaccinated you're more likely to become a super spreader and 'kill grandma', delay/prevent herd immunity and allow for mutant strains. 

Not sure why you are unable to grasp the concept that we all need to do our part to stop this pandemic.
 

Are you really that Dense and/or Selfish? Jeez, get a clue or take a remedial biology course. 

Take chances on the dance floor. 

So have the anti-vaxxers here also stopped wearing masks because they're young and healthy?

Vaccine Hesitant is the PC term to use now. 
 

but yeah, fuck these anti-vaxxers 

this was a good listen and actually explains the psychology behind vaccine hesitancy and the best way to communicate facts to that segment of the population. I sure as shit don't have the patience with the conspiracy nuts that these experts do, mainly because it's a fools errand to try and convince a narcissist that they should care about others

https://www.kqed.org/forum/2010101883118/the-search-to-understand-vaccin...

You can get vaccinated for free with no appointment today at the Marin County Civic Center, all guy need is ID and to show up.....

Free Gates microchip injections! 
 

yeah, plenty of appointments at Stanford Clinics today and walk up clinics at Facebook headquarters. They're probably injecting the Zuck microchip at that one

They're probably injecting the Zuck microchip at that one
 

LOLOL

Just got a mysterious phone message from someone named Mark - really, no shit!

I know several Marks, but none with the number shown on the screen. 

Hmmmm........

haven't read the thread but imagine this has to do white trash thinking a passport would impinge on their freedom? they also hate hillary too? 

^ Yeah, doctors treating infectious patients wear that PPE  as do vulnerable people who can't risk getting Covid during the pandemic. 

PPE saves lives, and conspiracy theorists denying the millions of Covid deaths can piss off

The CDC finally admits it was wrong about surface transmission of COVID-19

https://www.denverpost.com/2021/04/13/cdc-surface-transmission-rare-covi...

Nice self portrait, Racket.

Now Turning Down Excess Doses, U.S. Faces Calls To Share Vaccines

Honduras has obtained a paltry 59,000 vaccine doses for its 10 million people, while in the United States, nearly 90 million people have been fully vaccinated.

https://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/us_60847fffe4b05af50db67c10

...

No, that's the person who is calling you an idiot 

texas is calling

https://youtu.be/DPum8Cmxjqw

Rick Workman - Vaccine Finder

Vaccine passports are racist.

When I travel to Europe, whenever that is, I will not mind showing that I am vaccinated with documentation other than the button with Mouse's art - that might be necessary.

What makes vaccine passports racist? Educate me.

You're wasting your breath

Crying racism about things that aren't racist is racist 

there are inequities in the distribution of vaccines between affluent white populations and poor or POC populations, therefore segregating these populations with a vaccine passport is racist.  
 

Any chance you could post another meme to explain that? The last one was extremely effective- I'm considering giving up on listening to doctors and science.

Not here, anyone who wants vaccine can get it. We have 2 central walk in locations, one drive through, pop up community clinics in every neighborhood and will come to your home if you can't get in. All races and ethnicities welcome and included. Anyone over 16 that's wants a shot has access and most clinics now aren't requiring appts. I commend our leadership for making this so available to all

Americans who are against vaccine passports can simply move to a state where vaccine passports have already been outlawed. 
 

Like Idaho, Texas, Florida, or South Dakota...

it's a free country.

Free California

I don’t think it will catch on... it’s looking much more like restrictions will just be lifted, I’m thinking by Memorial Day weekend... some larger venues and businesses like travel, sports, and concerts may adopt perks for those who can prove vaccination and schools / jobs will require it..

Ironically, but not unexpectedly, many of the people who think that business owners should be able to pick their clients based on what they believe is a choice, sexual orientation, do not think that those same businesses should  be able to choose clients based on the choice of vaccinations.

That "choice" of sexual preference hurts no one. The choice to not vaccinate can hurt many.

Praise be...

Nurse fish lives in a bubble.

https://www.kff.org/coronavirus-covid-19/issue-brief/latest-data-on-covi...

From your link

"A number of states are implementing strategies to address these disparities, and the federal government is launching a range of approaches to expand vaccine access and uptake, with a particular focus on reaching underserved areas and communities hardest hit by the pandemic."

im in one of those areas...  which bubble are you in?

Nancy, where is your evidence? Here's an article talking about how they don't have enough research to tell you whether or not transmission is effectively reduced from getting a vaccine. The doctors don't have enough clinical data to say that so where's your proof of what you're stating?

https://www.webmd.com/vaccines/covid-19-vaccine/news/20210401/can-vaccinations-stop-covid-transmission

Here is another articles which talks about how they don't really have any information about how the vaccine reduces transmission wi th asymptotic people. Since the whole argument for masks is that people may be symptomatic, once again I ask where are you getting your information? 
 

They say because you have a reduced chance of getting an infection that you can reduce transmission but they also don't have any evidence for whether or not you can be asymptomatic while being vaccinated since the early trials didn't concentrate on that. Show your evidence of your claims nanc

Lol, Timpy troll. No interest in conversing with with a rat fink and science flunky. 
 

The people in our community that care so much about ending racism and inequalities volunteer at clinics and other charities that address the needs of the disadvantaged.
 

And yes, in the Bay Area there is no shortage of vaccination clinics and other services for  disadvantaged communities. 

Racket is so concerned about racism that he trolls online. 

Here is the other article which contradicts your claims, Nancy. 
 

https://www.healthline.com/health-news/if-youre-vaccinated-can-you-transmit-covid-19-what-we-know#Some-vaccines-block-most-infections

Aside from Oakland The Bay Area is all white folks. What are you talking about? California is one of the most racists places in the country. Pretty much the pioneers of systemic racism and for profit prisons and using black bodies for inventory.

Not trolling. I provided evidence against your false claims. 

What were the exact claims you were refuting?

Above, nanc claims that mRNA vaccines are 90% effective against transmission of Covid. I asked her to show her evidence.

((((( rat finks )))))

(image used w/o permission)

mRNA vaccine effectiveness of full immunization (≥14 days after second dose) was 90% against SARS-CoV-2 infections regardless of symptom status; vaccine effectiveness of partial immunization (≥14 days after first dose but before second dose) was 80%.

https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7013e3.htm

https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanmic/article/PIIS2666-5247(21)00069-0/fulltext

Talking about transmission, Mikey. Any evidence?

The argument is not an the efficiency of the vaccines. 

“If you can’t get infected, you can’t infect anyone else, which means the vaccines can reduce transmission as well as the disease,” says Marm Kilpatrick, an infectious diseases researcher at the University of California, Santa Cruz.

https://www.sciencenews.org/article/coronavirus-covid-vaccine-moderna-pf...

Your links didn't refute the claims. They said that we currently don't have longitudinal data. My guess is that when that data does come in, it will show over 50% due to decreased viral load.

Either way, the vaccines are pretty good to get.

What is pretty clear is that you are better with it then without it

In my Bubble the evidence is clear 0 Staff infections for the past 2 weeks for the first time since sept. while Kids are still getting covid 

Correct, they don't have the data. I was asking Nanc to give her evidence to which she was basing her claim. At this point, her claim is baseless. 

I'm not for vax passports but I have gotten the vaccine. It's a good way to get the antibodies in your system. 
 

I don't really see why anyone who has gotten sick recently with covid would really need the vaccine. I heard msg is letting people into concerts/ events who have antibodies tests.

There's a substantial population of POC in the Bay Area outside of Oakland, Mr_timpane. Black, Latinx (who do you think is doing much of the shit work throughout the area?), living North, South and East of Oakland.

Racket, Oregon is also significantly broadening the geography of where vaccines are being given in easy-to-get locations and situations. Eastern Oregon where there is low population, many rednecks, is approx 1/3 of the state's land, is now being focussed on. Clinics are being held in cities and urban areas throughout the state - the vaccines are coming to the people.

^ Lol, wow Judit. So the blacks and "latinx" are just there to do the shit work? 

Did I say that? No, I didn't.

Referring to the Latinx, I said that that's who is doing much of the shit work though out the area.

Yes, actually you did say that. But can you tell me what the black population of mill valley is?Larkspur? Fairfax? Lol. It's all white people, Asian and some Hispanics

us Hispanics are only there to do the "shit work though. You know, judit like mowing white peoples lawns and cleaning their dirty dishes at restaurants. 

I can't tell you the Black population of Marin.

And no, I didn't say that people are "only there to do the shit work".

What's actually important to you about what I wrote (and it seems you've now twisted)? 

What did you mean then?

Your post at 1:35:  Aside from Oakland The Bay Area is all white folks.

My post at 2:42: There's a substantial population of POC in the Bay Area outside of Oakland, Mr_timpane.

What I meant was, that the people who are doing much of the shit work throughout the area live North, South and East of Oakland.

The use of "Latinx" is linguistic imperialism.  Stay woke.

>>> The use of "Latinx" is linguistic imperialism. <<<

Opinions about that differ and abound.

My unscientific survey suggests:

Hispanics 30+ thinks it's a waste of energy/outrage/concern/whatever.

Hispanics 50+ think it's a typo.

Some people are nothing without their outrage. Even inclusion is offensive 

When are we going to get a vaccination for derp?

I think it's slightly disingenuous to call me dense and an anti vaxxer for expressing very reasoned and thought-out criticisms of the mass vaccination effort that are shared by many in the scientific community.  To the accusation of being anti vaxx, my daughter and I are up to date on all our vaccinations and boosters, obviously Covid aside, based on what I've shared here.  It's amazing to me that to share a valid criticism shared by so many scientists can evoke such visceral disgust.  I don't think it's unreasonable at all to ask questions; things are moving so fast right now and we're living through the largest human experiment in history.  It's equally amazing to me how everyone is so willing to bow down to their pharma overlords so blindly; it's not like these companies have never lied to us or misled us with clinical studies in the name of profit generation.  These vaccines represent entirely new technology and were (understandably) rushed to market.  I'm concerned about side effects from taking a vaccine that my body has already demonstrated I don't need- vaccines which could impact my body's innate ability to respond to future exposure to variants.

I understand it's difficult for folks today to listen to and consider points of view that challenge their current understanding but if you are at all interested in hearing these criticisms fleshed out in full by a virologist and biologist, I recommend checking out the latest episode of the Dark Horse podcast hosted by Bret Weinstein.  Available where you get your podcasts.

Ted Nugent thought he was "fine/good to go" too and Ron Johnson (R-WI) also *thinks* COVID vaccines are irrelevant. Neither has any medical background or such expertise on which to lean. A quick search on Bret Weinstein would appear to show him being somewhat of a lightning rod whom has seemingly also been pushing his boogeyman drug/vaccine stance for at least 20 years and COVID just gave him even more of a platform to do so, not to mention that he's cozied up to Joe Rogan. I am no fan of big Pharma either but would also point to a much more broadly-based group of scientists and medical professionals whom do endorse and highly recommend COVID vaccinations. I think it was 20 nursing home patients in PA whom recently contracted COVID after being fully vaccinated but NONE of them became seriously illl or required hospitalizations. THAT is what the vaccines basically aimed for and apparently are achieving..

There were opponents to the smallpox vaccine and throughout vaccination history. Opposition and skepticism are not new phenomena 

As usual I didn't read much of this thread because of the endless snark and the seeming lack of intelligent, respectful discussion, but Jay's respectful post bumped me to join in.

Someone may have already asked this, and it seems a pretty basic concept, but while of course the vaccines are new & rushed and it's all a bit of an experiment and risks are involved, I ask... what's the alternative?

If one accepts the basic and obvious reality that the virus is very real, that in a little over a year it has killed millions of people and that it will continue to morph world-wide, it seems there are only three choices;

1. Continue the lockdown for years until we know FOR SURE that the vaccines are OK, and watch societies crumble in the meantime 

2. Just say fuck it, go back to normal life and watch as eventually many if not most older people die a miserable death, watch it creep into and disable and kill more & more younger people, all of that forcing our hospitals to become over-run to the point of being unable to function, have multitudes more nurses & other vital medical professionals quit because of mental anguish, physical fatigue & fear of contracting the disease, which will only add to the crumbling of health care in general and lead to more & more unnecessary misery and death

3. Take the vaccine and hope that the greatest minds in the world have actually done their job well, allowing things to creep back to normalcy. History has shown that very often humans are at our best when things are worst, and especially given the other alternatives, in this case I'm willing to take the chance that money was not the over-riding factor in developing these vaccines, and that under the biggest pressure really smart people had to be really smart about this and did their job well.

Now, for those who think the whole thing is over-blown, it's just the flu, it's not that big a deal, it's a fraud, whatever... well there's nothing to say to any of that except, as Prince would say... we'll just put you over there.

I've said this before, and I think it's still an accurate way of looking at this situation... Our country, and really the entire world has been invaded and completely occupied by an evil, invisible enemy, an enemy that has killed millions of our weakest people in horrible fashion, an enemy that is in your town/in your neighborhood right now looking for more people to kill, an enemy that is showing no signs of leaving.

We're at war, and we've been getting our ass kicked.

Given that situation, sacrifices & potentially serious/deadly risks have to be taken to fight & defeat that enemy, just as sacrifices & deadly risks have to be taken against any other enemy that would occupy your neighborhood, determined to hurt and very often kill you and your family.

Jay, if Isis lunatics determined to destroy everything had over-run your city, were in your neighborhood today kicking in doors and killing people along the way, and desperate officials knocked on your door to give you a gun and ask you to take the risks and join your neighbors in the fight, what would you do?

The vaccines are risky, we don't know about long-term issues, but again I ask, in the face of this heartless enemy that is all around us, that has killed millions and wants to kill us all in our homes, what's the alternative?

Maybe I'm missing something, but I say there's no choice but to make the sacrifice, join the fight and face the risks to defeat the enemy.

Or cower at home and let others take the risk and fight the fight.

> make the sacrifice

People don't like to sacrifice anymore. It's not trending.

People want sacrifices made for them not by them. That's the new trend. Folks don't want to bear any responsibility when there is so many people available to blame for things. Plus it doesn't fill the outrage quota as quickly 

We can't even sacrifice space for people to live. Bad for investment. 

>>> The use of "Latinx" is linguistic imperialism. <<<

I just asked my son who is Mexican-American about the term.  He said its appropriate in the United States and basically comes down to what you are most comfortable with using (he personally prefers "Latino").   He also says its being used more in progressive circles in Mexico and Chile where the gender neutral "x" suffix is already being used and that its probably the more proper term to use when interacting with people whose gender identity is not immediately clear.   

Hahaha.  Thanks.

Thanks, Ken.

Does this apply to all Romance languages?

The thing about Latinx is it doesn't account for the gender of all the other nouns, pronouns, and adjectives in Spanish.

How do you pronounce latinx in Spanish?

¿Latinequis?

You have no idea and basically no clue how diverse my community is

Do you believe it's your right to not stop at stop signs?Everyone has a right to express their opinions 

And to be in an independent thinker

Best of luck to you

but I  hope I'm never on the same street that you are

>>>A quick search on Bret Weinstein would appear to show him being somewhat of a lightning rod whom has seemingly also been pushing his boogeyman drug/vaccine stance for at least 20 years and COVID just gave him even more of a platform to do so

What you just said, essentially, was that- rather than listen to what the man has to say (and make up your own mind!)- you did a quick search and would rather blindly take the "determined consensus" as the word of truth.  Got it.  That's very revealing and I appreciate the honesty.  Bret has a doctorate in evolutionary biology and did his thesis work on bats.  I take his opinions very seriously given his credentials, experience in the field and the manner in which he carries himself.  Again, I implore those who are interested in hearing a reasoned critique of what's going on to give a listen.

Do you think Glen Greenwald is a racist, transphobic fascist?  That's what the Twitter-sphere determined recently as well.  To base your determinations on someone's worthiness to the confines of a quick Google search is disheartening and par for the course today unfortunately.

https://abc7news.com/black-homeowner-problems-sf-bay-area-housing-discri...

>  it's slightly disingenuous to call me dense and an anti vaxxer

I can't speak to the density issue, Jay, nor would I, but if you are against getting vaccinated for Covid, you are now, by definition, an anti-vaxxer.

>  my daughter and I are up to date on all our vaccinations and boosters, obviously Covid aside

I think most people who identify as anti-vaxxers probably got their shots as kids, and later changed their thinking about this topic once they were exposed to a new ideology.

^Right.  While just getting my daughter fully vaccinated in the last 2 years.

Old folks are scarred shitless to leave their houses but they also at the same time they want to go sit their fat asses down, eat hot dogs and watch baseball. You guys are fucking crazy.

I respect Siobuds decision to not get the vax if he doesn't want to. Trying to shame people into it is some low shit. Only you are responsible for your safety. Shut the fuck up and live the rest of your life trapped in your cave, scarred and watching CNN. Younger people don't really care anymore. Might as well just get used to it 

To be clear, Jay, I'm not trying to convince you that you should get the vaccine; that's your call. I just find it interesting how vehemently you reject the anti-vaxxer label.

He's just waiting a little longer than most. If he's socially distancing and contact tracing, he should survive. 

mike, people have used the anti-vaxxer label to describe people who didn't have their kids vaccinated for child-hood diseases, and Jay is clearly saying he's not one of those, having gotten his daughter fully vaccinated.

judit, I'm thinking of the term in a more generic way--"a person who is opposed to vaccination"--and not the politically-charged meaning. I thought I made that clear above when I wrote "most people who identify as anti-vaxxers".

Good news is that vaccinated adults seems to be protected from the new more contagious and deadlier Covid  strains now circulating  in many parts of the country. And  since the vaccine  offers some protection in terms of reducing transmission to their kids waiting for their turn to get vaccinated, those families who aren't "vaccine hesitant" are much less likey to suffer the adverse effects of the deadly disease. As schools re-open, let's hope they all require the Covid vaccines for kids so that they can operate safely. 

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/michigan-record-breaking-number-chi...

and then there's Florida..

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/04/26/us/florida-centner-academy-vaccine.html

Timp thinks it's about age

And his phone seems to have Tourette's now too.

From Nancy's NYT link:

"Even among our own population, we have at least three women with menstrual cycles impacted after having spent time with a vaccinated person," [Ms. Centner, one of the school's co-founders] wrote, repeating a false claim that vaccinated people can somehow pass the vaccine to others and thereby affect their reproductive systems. (They can do neither.)

Jay, if you hadn't already had the Rona, would you be more inclined to get the vaccine? I was in that position I'd also question it. Then again, I think of Tim, who had 2 bouts.

Also, how'd that pillow treat you?

my niece had Covid last year and was vaccinated a few weeks ago.
 

since the antibodies don't stick around forever, it's a smart decision for anyone previously infected, can offer additional protection from other Covid strains and can act like a 'booster' vaccine

Covid is a nasty fuckin illness, as long haulers - and their surviving friends/family know
 

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-04-22/-long-hauler-study-sh...

I'd like to start suing people that get to close or shoot them. 

Frontline special on coronavirus literally just started on PBS...

Fwiw

>> I just find it interesting how vehemently you reject the anti-vaxxer label

Judit kinda nailed my sentiment.  I've unfriended hippy chicks in my circle on social media and have been very outspoken amongst my peers on how fucked I think it is that people aren't vaccinating their children for all the typicals and how we're seeing all this stuff come back.  The way in which you applied the anti-vaxx label for me strikes me as you labeling me as one of those folks I've disowned in my personal life.  I think the vaccines we're discussing have very obvious differences that are apparent to everyone and I think most of us here understand that labeling someone as anti-vaxx suggests the person isn't vaccinating their children against mumps, etc.  I included the detail of my daughter's up-to-date vaccination status to make it clear that I believe in vaccination in general.  I think it's moronic not to and, again, this particular vaccine we're discussing here is so goddamn new and was rushed to market.  I think a little skepticism is healthy and I did state I am undecided on taking the vaccine- not against it.

>>Jay, if you hadn't already had the Rona, would you be more inclined to get the vaccine?

Ugh- honestly, man, I don't know.  As you're aware I've been dealing with an extreme auto immune disorder the last few years from exposure to mold and that is playing a major role in my hesitation to get the jab.  I have an appointment with my new PCP to discuss my concerns and also to ping him on ordering me some of the labs that Dr. Lauren Tessier recommends.  She follows the Shoemaker protocol which is the goldstandard for identifying and treating mold-related illness.  

I was considerably scared to catch Covid- much more concerned than most my age.  I eat a completely clean diet free of processed carbs/meat and have seriously been leaving no stone unturned in trying to figure this shit out.  The vaccine does scare me because there are so many unresolved questions with my health I struggle to find answers for and I KNOW I kicked Covid's ass the first time.  That's where I'm at.

>> How's the pillow?

It's good- I do like it.. I haven't committed to it fully though.  I go back and forth with the My Pillow depending on what I'm feeling.  I just got a wedge pillow for my legs which has been helpful.  I'm also doing 30mg of CBD which has been very helpful.  It's pretty remarkable looking at the marked increase in my time spent in deep sleep.  I've been pretty floored by it.

> I've unfriended hippy chicks in my circle on social media

My god, man, have you lost your mind? I feel like I should regift send you my copy of Jay Blakesberg's book Hippie Chick to offset the loss a bit.

But seriously, Jay, thanks for your thoughtful response. I can see now that I used the term "anti-vaxxer" much too lightly, and probably should have thought more about how that would be received.

About age>>
 

The elderly are the ones dying so it kinda is. If everyone was just getting sick but getting over it in a week then no one would really care. In a perfect world, maybe every one would care about each other's safety but in our reality that's just not the way it works so you are responsible for your own safety. The whole "we are in this together" is just trash. A nice slogan for Walmart to run outside their store to attract business, nothing more. Once older folks get over their fears of the covid it will become less marketable and we can return to everyday life. As long as people remain completely intoxicated with fear then there is a boatload of money to be made from The pandemic. 

Anyone who decided to pass on the J and J vax and didn't end up with a brain aneurysm then kudos to them. Damn "anti vaxxers"

Thanks for the response, Jay. Did you tell Dr T that you learned about her on a dbmb?

Timpy, Jesus, what the fuck are you rambling on about?

>>> About age>>
The elderly are the ones dying so it kinda is. <<<

That is kinda true, but not. And death is not the only measure of Covid's disastrous effects. And there have been many young/middle aged people who've died from the sequelae, from blood clots, respiratory failure, organ failure, etc.
You may remember the article written by a (previously) healthy young friend of mine, a woman in her 30's and another by her husband, in which they describe the disastrously debilitating effects of her have a mildish case of Covid in the Spring of last year. She has not recovered yet.

And suicides, business failures, more people on the streets without homes, it all counts.

Of course we're all in this together. 
 

"Eight months after mild COVID-19, one in ten people still has at least one moderate to severe symptom"

Too bad the' vaccine hesitant'  don't understand how this all works. 

https://denver.cbslocal.com/2021/04/27/covid-cases-children-middle-high-...

>DENVER (CBS4)– The number of people hospitalized with COVID-19 continues to rise in Colorado. The total is at 622 patients as of Tuesday. That number has more than doubled since March 24 and the highest since the end of January.

The Colorado Department of Public Health and Environment also reported more than 2,000 new cases on Tuesday. Part of the recent increase in cases are children of all ages becoming sick with COVID-19...

..The state health department also shared information about the correlation between those not vaccinated and the increase in COVID. Counties with more people vaccinated are seeing fewer people get sick with COVID. In that study, Pueblo and El Paso counties have more cases with fewer people vaccinated.

What a shithole.

^^My 13 year-old REALLY wants to get vaccinated!

>It’s Not Vaccine Hesitancy. It’s COVID-19 Denialism.

http://on.theatln.tc/GpP4hbb?fbclid=IwAR2HPoihhbom-oOk6ljMTsEMf8gAy-CMIl...

>..For some vaccine refusers, the motivation is simply trolling. An essay in American Greatness, which is what passes for the intellectual outpost of Trumpism, published yesterday explains, “My primary reason for refusing the vaccine is much simpler [than worries about personal liberty or medical complications]: I dislike the people who want me to take it, and it makes them mad when they hear about my refusal.”

I think even some people who know deep down that the virus is real still agree with the sentiments above.

Of course, much like the Fox News personalities they worship.
 

So half of Oregon, including this town, is being put back on "extreme risk" level on Friday.   We have had some of the lowest Covid rates in the country, but apparently not anymore.   Now that I am fully vaccinated, I was supposed to go see a local jamgrass band at a neighborhood pub next weekend, but unsure if that will still be happening with the heightened restrictions. 

Fuckin Covid deniers, Vaccine Hesitants and Anti Vaxxers are to blame. 

India is fucked because  they opened up too early, and of course they didn't have the vaccine distribution that we have in the US, and still we're all still at risk because of the ignorant and narcissistic fools are refusing to do their part  to stop the spread and get vaccinated. 

The Vaccine passports can't come soon enough. 

>>> Fuckin Covid deniers, Vaccine Hesitants and Anti Vaxxers are to blame.  <<<

In Oregon we've just started having vaccine for people as young as 16 and they're getting them. As Ken said above, we are being on "extreme risk" level. There are  a ot of new cases here in Eugene/Springfield of kids 15-16 and 13-15. These kids are infecting each other NOT IN CLASSROOMS, but via pickup sports like basketball, and fewer by impromptu get togethers. We can't say they fall in the groups you blame, Nancy, I think it''s more kids not wearing masks while playing sports. Maybe just being kids?

If all the adults were vaccinated then there were be less spread to the kids.
And absolutely, indoor and contact sports with no masks are going to spread the virus

everyone should be vaccinated before they return to school, camps and team sports. No passport no go

Golf is safer. 

Tucker Carlson telling his audience to call the cops if they see kids outdoors wearing masks probably isn't helping too.

> Golf is safer.

Lee Trevino might disagree with that.

How does someone phrase that to a cop?

Lee Trevino is alive and still playing golf. 

Ask Tucker how to phrase that. It's kind of funny though because he's also been complaining about how cities have become havens for lawlessness and anarchy. And the cops have time for false claims of abuse?

Edit: Hasn't Trevino been hit by lightning on the golf course a couple three times?