Louis CK

https://www.msn.com/en-us/movies/news/louis-cks-movie-premiere-canceled-...

From 2012: http://gawker.com/5894527/which-beloved-comedian-likes-to-force-female-c...

The old Irish Skidoo.  Mayer is into that too.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OQnNH7I07RY

check out my new bit

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=apc85Cp4lQQ&t=1m4s

never thought he was funny.  good riddance. 

>>>The old Irish Skidoo.  Mayer is into that too.

i thought brick was just joking but clearly this is actually a thing.

filthy, filthy Irishmen

"When Mexico sends its people, they're not sending their best. They're not sending you. They're not sending you. They're sending people that have lots of problems, and they're bringing those problems with us. They're bringing drugs. They're bringing crime. They're rapists." 

Is that the pervert's version of I'm not touching you?

I was bummed to see this one.  So creepy to see how people take advantage of whatever power they may have over people. 

I mean, it's not like I've never asked a woman to watch me masturbate (we all have, right?), it's one of the first pick up lines we learn.

Can you imagine all the famous or once famous men in Hollywood who are scared as shit because they know they've used their power to do terrible things to women?

It must be like they are just waiting for the shoe to fall.  Who's next?

Pretty horrible.

Trevor Noah addressing Louis CK on The Daily Show

 “we’re going to need a new Oscar category -

 best actor whose movies we can’t watch anymore”

>>>best actor whose movies we can’t watch anymore”

Eastwood and Gibson alternated winning those every other year for a while, with Christian Bale and Baldwin taking it home from time to time.

Wide open now.

Pee Wee wasn't that bad, after all...he was just a self-diddler in the privacy of a "movie house".

Agreed Ned.

Pee Wee still rocks.

Louis just released a written confession and apology

Louis has owned it in a statement he just released. 

Sorry no link, google it.

http://www.tmz.com/2017/11/10/louis-c-k-confession-masturbation-women-ac...

He didn't really apologize though, did he?

Fair enough, Sam.

seems to b more of a remorseful admission of guilt in nature rather than an overtly apologetic one.

I thought it appropriate.

It's written as if he deliberately thought, "I don't want to say I'm sorry, I want to say something that will make them know I am sorry."

That said, it's well written, sincere, and appropriate.

idk it seems like he is just a perv. he asked all the women first...they all said yes. i kinda get the power thing, but this all happened before louis was really popular, when he was just writing for TV and pretty much unknown outside of the standup world. seems like he just has a weird kink. afaik its a pretty common kink to want to be watched while masturbating, and if that is your kink, i cant really think of a better way to fulfill that kink than by asking someone if they would like to participate. is there supposed to be an elaborate series of hand gestures or some kind of password system by which you find someone to watch you jerk off and its just me and louis ck that missed the memo? yeah, its creepy, but im not seeing this as some kind of weinstein level sexual assult. 

seems like he is struggling with a part of his sexuality, apologized years before this became public, and recognized it was an issue he wanted to work on. having seen almost all of CK's work, this is absolutely no supprise. he's never been specific but the immense self loathing and darkness in his routines had to come from somewhere. he was known as a brutally honest comic, but for some reason people thought when he would talk about being a "prisoner to perverted thoughts" or "the darkness" that he was just talking about eating to many cookies??? he has basically been warning us for years that he is a creepy perv.

looks like his new film is not going to be coming out for awhile, which i am really bummed about, i was really exited to see it and still am. i guess at least this means tickets for his next tour will be cheap and plentiful.

>>  he asked all the women first...they all said yes.

Uhh... no they didn't. Did you read the original article? Not even close. I understand the impulse to apologize for him because his self-loathing does come through in his comedy and he's almost pitiable as an individual, but that's not at all an excuse, full stop. 

I wish I could remember the sketch were the couple was nearing the wing dang do when they stopped to have the lawyers come in and negotiate the deets of the doo wah diddy. 

Totally with people speaking up but damn if I was out there these days I think I would be careful.

As it should be.  

"I mean, it's not like I've never asked a woman to watch me masturbate (we all have, right?), it's one of the first pick up lines we learn."

Uhm, no and no.

"they all said yes."

Nope.  Apparently he was under the impression that asking and not getting a positive response still made it okay.

"looks like his new film is not going to be coming out for awhile"

Yea.  Like in ten years.  On an obscure streaming service.

"which i am really bummed about, i was really exited to see it and still am."

Really?  I'd have a really hard time watching the guy in anything at this point, but then I was never a huge fan.

Still electable in Alabama roll tide 

>>>"I mean, it's not like I've never asked a woman to watch me masturbate (we all have, right?), it's one of the first pick up lines we learn."

>>Uhm, no and no.

Oh, Thom...don't ever go changing, you white, right wing, sweater vest wearing rock star.

>>>its a pretty common kink to want to be watched while masturbating,

It is?

It's common to want to be watched?  I get that you can find basicallyanything and some people are going to be into it (this is a large world) but that's a common fantasy?

I guess I'll take your word for it but...kind having a hard time wrapping my head around it though.

This whole thing has jumped from "he raped me" to "he's a big fucking perv!" with everyone in the moral authority expressing their faux outrage via vapid social media channels.

Silly. 

Well, he has fessed up to it, and says that just because he asked permission didn't make it right:

"At the time, I said to myself that what I did was okay because I never showed a woman my dick without asking first, which is also true. But what I learned later in life, too late, is that when you have power over another person, asking them to look at your dick isn't a question. It's a predicament for them."

https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/11/10/563316860/louis-c-k-a...

Meh. Creepy perv. I think Daylight is close to being right.  I'll still watch him. Part of his appeal to me has been his brutal self honesty. Anyone not listening to the GD for such activity?  Careful in your response. They ALL done wrong to women is my guess. Like someone posted, the rocknroll world is on watch and they are sweating it. Who's Next? (get it, pete townsend the pedo?). In my eyes NO means NO. I am not an apologist for abhorrent behavior. Im stating that I am still able to enjoy his work. Like creepy musicians.

Separating the art from the artist has always been a problem.

>>>But what I learned later in life, too late, is that when you have power over another person, asking them to look at your dick isn't a question. It's a predicament for them."

To me, that's complete bullshit.  He knew it was wrong and he knew why it was wrong.  He knew the women didn't want to be there, that they wouldn't be there if he wasn't in the position he was in.

It would have come off better if he admitted he knew it was wrong at the time and was fucked up enough to do it anyway--at least that would have sounded more genuine.

Mind if I shit on your coffee table? 

What the............ 

Schplatt.... 

Dude, WTF? 

Hey I asked first. 

>>>Uhh... no they didn't. Did you read the original article? Not even close.

the original NYT article says one of the women did say yes, and the other two laughed, and then stayed until after he came. if i did not want to watch a man jerk off, i would 1) say no, and 2) leave the room if he started.

im not saying these women asked him to, or enjoyed it, but it does not sound like he forced anybody into anything.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rjm6h9_mM4s

"I see piss comin' I move, she see piss comin' she stay."

>>>its a pretty common kink to want to be watched while masturbating,

It is?

It's common to want to be watched?  I get that you can find basicallyanything and some people are going to be into it (this is a large world) but that's a common fantasy?

I guess I'll take your word for it but...kind having a hard time wrapping my head around it though.

think about the sterotype of the "flasher", the man in a trench coat exposing himself. its common enough to be an easily recognizable stereotype. i think also the phenomenon of men sending women unsolicited dick pics thru social media and tinder is also due to exhibitionist fantasy. 

Anyone not listening to the GD for such activity?  Careful in your response. They ALL done wrong to women is my guess.

"Well, she was just 14, but she had the body of an 8 year old."

- Actual Bob Weir quote, 1980

>>  if i did not want to watch a man jerk off, i would 1) say no, and 2) leave the room if he started.

Easy to say as a hypothetical. But my sense is that it's quite a bit different when the man has enormous pull in your industry, which is already very difficult for women to break into, and you know that if you react badly or expose him that might be the end of your career. There's a lot more going on than just some flabby prick pulling out his shabby dick.

Well, according to Bob Weir, his dog has no nose. When, in fact, he did have a nose.

>>  if i did not want to watch a man jerk off, i would 1) say no, and 2) leave the room if he started.

Did you miss the part where he blocked the door of the hotel room when they tried?

>>>Did you miss the part where he blocked the door of the hotel room when they tried?

During Ms. Goodman and Ms. Wolov’s surreal visit to Louis C.K.’s Aspen hotel room, they said they were holding onto each other, screaming and laughing in shock, as Louis C.K. masturbated in a chair. “We were paralyzed,” Ms. Goodman said.

i did not see that anywhere in the article, sounds like he was sitting down while they laughed, and instead of trying to leave, felt paralyzed...where are you getting this about him blocking the door and them trying to leave? 

>>>Easy to say as a hypothetical. But my sense is that it's quite a bit different when the man has enormous pull in your industry, which is already very difficult for women to break into, and you know that if you react badly or expose him that might be the end of your career. There's a lot more going on than just some flabby prick pulling out his shabby dick.

for sure, i think louis touched on that several times in his statement/apology, and at the same time this is not louis in 2016 we are talking about, this was in 2002 when he was a nobody...at that time his last project was writing the movie "Pootie Tang"...not exactly a household name or someone with alot of power in the industry.

it was a fucked up thing to do, for sure.

most people generally dont deal with character flaws like this until it becomes a serious issue in their life, but that does not mean people cant make a sincere effort to change and that does not invalidate their art.

im sure no zoners have ever hurt another person, had sexual issues, done anything they regret or lied to anybody.

Sounds like he guy has some perversion issues. Should seek help in rehab for sex addiction. Obviously has a masturbation issue. Am I ready to put him in he same league as Harvey and Cosby? Not quite but still the guy obviously has some issues. I think it’s pretty odd they took down his stuff from HBO. If we were to get rid of all the art created by artists with sexual issues they’re wouldn’t be much left.

>>  If we were to get rid of all the art created by artists with sexual issues they’re wouldn’t be much left.

Pretty sure that's not true 

>>>>>If we were to get rid of all the art created by artists with sexual issues they’re wouldn't be much left.<<<<

^^^^^This is it in a "nut" shell..

 Most people including artists have lots of issues.  All the hurtful acts being reported are a testament to our ability to separate art from the artist.  Looks like freedom of speech and censorship are holding a few high cards.  Resist and buckle up.

Make art

Make friends

Be nice to people

All these things might be tough to handle when you become a gazillionare.  

Such a difference between having personal issues like substance abuse and being a sexual predator

No doubt. I would never want to compare the two. 

Pretty sure you just equated them though

of course there is a difference, one only harms yourself while one harms others...i dont think anyone here is trying to say that what he did was ok at all.

just seems really indicative of a society that is still wrapped up so much in conservative christian beliefs on so many levels, that chris brown can still sell double platinum records after beating the shit out of his girlfriend and having it proven in court(dude isnt even allowed to enter AUS, NZ and the UK but america will still accept him as a pop culture icon), but a guy showing a handful of girls his dick is a career ending, nuclear fallout situation. 

Dang. that is a pretty valid point, DL

>> just seems really indicative of a society that is still wrapped up so much in conservative christian beliefs on so many levels, that chris brown can still sell double platinum records after beating the shit out of his girlfriend and having it proven in court(dude isnt even allowed to enter AUS, NZ and the UK but america will still accept him as a pop culture icon)

Lot of America doesn't accept him, and the part that does should have stopped years ago.

Would suggest that also has a lot to do with the fact that his victim was a black woman. You think if he was dating Katy Perry and beat her up and pictures of her bruised and swollen face were on magazine covers, he'd still be on a major label? I doubt it

Same story with R. Kelly by the way

How serious is Hollywood? I remain skeptical. 

Woody Allen's new movie is still set to premiere on December 1st. Roman Polanski just had a new movie at Cannes over the summer and was recently honored in Paris. 

Ultimately it's about the money of course. The leaders and lawyers at these media companies see which way the tide has gone since Weinstein and are acting accordingly by cutting people off as credible allegations come out. They're just business decisions. But most positive change happens when what benefits business lines up with what's moral and right, so have to take the change as we can get it.

He'll probably join ThePervZone.net. 

>> i did not see that anywhere in the article, sounds like he was sitting down while they laughed, and instead of trying to leave, felt paralyzed...where are you getting this about him blocking the door and them trying to leave? 

In 2012, Gawker published the story “Which Beloved Comedian Likes to Force Female Comics to Watch Him Jerk Off? ” about “our nation's most hilarious stand-up comic and critically cherished sitcom auteur” who “adds a thrilling twist to his onanistic escapades: He traps unsuspecting women in his hotel room and makes them stick around until he's done.” It described an incident at the Aspen Comedy Festival where he started masturbating in front of two female comedians who had joined him in his room, blocking the door until he finished. C.K. wasn’t named, but commenters pointed to him. 

http://www.newsweek.com/louis-ck-louis-ck-masturbate-masturbation-i-love...

I bet Thom does it through a hole in a sheet.  Lights off.

>> a hole in a sheet.  Lights off.

Ahh, sexy ortho-Jew style. Very nice. 

I watched some Curb Your Enthusiasm after the bad news yesterday, it was so oddly refreshing.

Now, that Larry David, now there's a guy who I'm sure has never acted out a weird kink or strange fantasy ever in his life.

Oh wait that's all dudes. Oh, ALL dudes do whacky shit? Oh yeah that's right. It's just a matter of checking oneself, checking the situation, and not be doing any harm to others (although you want to keep checking, communication with someone you are involved with sexually might I dont know, be a good thing? ).

>> I'd have a really hard time watching the guy in anything at this point, but then I was never a huge fan.

That's funny. I was just listening to some Chuck Berry. I heard he had some rather, uh, unusual interests? Interesting.. quirks?

When I said does it through a sheet I meant that’s how he sees at the rallies with his stormfront buddies

Exactly also lights are off because they don't want to attract the insects while theyre carrying tiki torches to the university library in protest of the liberals and their racial mixing.

Uncle Sam, the point is to separate the person from the art. And yes they’re are many artists who had sexual issues at some point. You could prob throw a rock and hit a woman to claim sexual assault against members of the Grateful Dead. According to Barlow “the scene was about as mysognistic as it gets”. Pigeon talking about “I don’t care if she’s only 15 years of age.” They should just take down all the GD stuff off the archive. Ban it, right? Pretty stupid they removed his shows and stand up from HBO. Really doesn’t have anything to do these allegations. Sexual predators are hot right now in the news. Shits selling like hot cakes. 

>>>>>I don’t care if she’s only 15 years of age

actually 14 is the youngest age he ever said; despite what Delia says. 

^Yea, I think you’re right. Grimey drunk. I wonder if Uncle Sam will ever be able to listen to Pigpens music again. 

I bet Thom does it through a hole in a sheet.  Lights off.<<<

Come on now, Hoover and Axtec. How bout just a tad slower.

Fucking harsh.

>>> Ban it, right? Pretty stupid they removed his shows and stand up from HBO. Really doesn’t have anything to do these allegations.

if i owned HBO or netflix i'd feel like a creep making money off of and for sexual predators.  society shouldn't reward people for abusive behavior.

you may feel differently.

^You’re pretty naive. Hollywood/TV has been making money off of sexual predators for years. They don’t give a fuck about that. It’s political. I’m sure producers are quite “shameful” of how they make their money through movies and television. Come on now.

>>>>>>if i owned HBO or netflix i'd feel like a creep making money off of and for sexual predators.  society shouldn't reward people for abusive behavior. 

I think if you own a company that big you sold your soul long ago and wouldn’t really care.  

Netflix are still gonna push the fuck out of that last season of house of cards, lol. They don’t care.

So you'd be fine going into business with sex criminals?

I drive prostitutes around town all the time for Lyft.

are they typically good tippers?

Nope. But these owners of big businesses like HBO and Netflix don’t give a shit. They’re trying to make themselves look good. Soon as the storm has quotes down they’ll throw that shit right back up there. 

should have been more specific and said 'sexual predators', but i didn't want to keep using that term. it's more accurate, thou, so:

So you'd be fine going into business with sex predators?

Lyft prob wishes they could turn their company into a legit prostitution hustle. “Call Lyft, get a blow job while you ride.”

Only if Nope means yes.

I wouldn’t.  I’m just saying rich people don’t really seem to care about anything but money

I haven’t noticed they tip particularly well.

If I found out Scarlet Johansson was a sex predator and she wanted to hire me I’d say okay.

so you think they shouldn't pull his material because it is an insincere gesture made to look good to the public or do you think it shouldn't be pulled because something else?

or do you feel it should be pulled, but are saying they are doing it for the wrong reasons?

Should radio stations quit playing Lwd Zeppelin and The Rolling Stones?

>>> If I found out Scarlet Johansson was a sex predator and she wanted to hire me I’d say okay.

what if it was David Johansen?

I’ll have to google him but probably not

>>> Should radio stations quit playing Lwd Zeppelin and The Rolling Stones?

some of it, for unrelated reasons.

new york dolls

scarlet molesting people: ok

less attractive people molesting people: not so much

i get it

I mean isn’t that how it works.  If someone enjoys it it’s not harassment.  If they don’t like it then it’s harrasment.

I guess know your audience, or don’t be a creep, or something.

Im not endorsing anyone’s behavior.  

>>>>>>scarlet molesting people: ok

I was just speaking for myself.  I didn’t say she could go around molesting people and I’d be okay with that.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xKeG8xOR3Us&feature=youtu.be

Now it’s Richard Dreyfuss

Here media media,

Here press reporters...

Distraction.....distraction....

......meanwhile in Trump world

>>This whole thing has jumped from "he raped me" to "he's a big fucking perv!" with everyone in the moral authority expressing their faux outrage via vapid social media channels.<<

Exactly. I don't think Louis CK is a sexual predator, and I don't think women were permanently scarred if they saw him touch his dick. If they are traumatized by that 20 years later, I'd say there is more to work on than that one experience. If they are still upset about it 20 yrs later, then I understand, and it sounds like that's what he was addressing.

When we start to become the moral police, judging people by their kinks or fetishes, I think it's gone too far.

It seems more like Donald has a strategic plan to disenfranchise Hollywood's "morality" against his very existence.
Let's get back to shining the light on football players, who actually are rapey & violent towards women.

>When we start to become the moral police, judging people by their kinks or fetishes, I think it's gone too<

Jerking off in front of an unwilling audience is ok, but finding fault with such behavior is going too far? 

Are you sure you want to be an apologist for this type of behavior?

This thread could use some dick pics

No, I don’t think they should pull his work. Unrelated to the accusations. If an architect turned out to be a sexual predator would they knock down all the buildings he/she designed? 

Looks like liquid monkey ran out of trolling techniques when he found out he didn’t really think it through that well.

>>> Looks like liquid monkey ran out of trolling techniques wh

no. i went to bed. i'm on east coast and get up at 3am for work, so i was pretty tired by 11:30pm.

i stand by my statements.

I wonder if Cam is married or has daughters or sisters and how he'd feel if some guy whipped it out and started jackin' it if front of them.

would he judge that guy by his quirky fetish, or let it slide, because, ya know... guys will be guys.

>>> I was just speaking for myself.

so was i when i said i'd feel like a creep profiting off of a sex-creeps work.

>> Here media media,

Here press reporters...

Distraction.....distraction....<<

If you honestly think that what is going on with people coming forward about the prevalence of men with power abusing their privilege for sexual gain is really "distraction,"  from what's going on 'in Trump world,'

then you are honestly even dumber than you look.

Actually,

I was thinking about the depth that some of these " men of power"

are willing to go to conceal their crimes, and discredit their accusers.

Harvey Weinstein for instance...

Donny is also guilty as hell, and he's the fucking president.

They hire teams to deal with this shit.

Sadly, none of this is new news

and has been happening forever

And those who need to exposed should be held accountable.

But right now the timely new rounds of finger pointing sure are working out great...

For some....

Meanwhile......

And honestly,

You're more of a fucking asshole than you look Latex.

Keep up the strong work...

Maybe go contribute some more celebrity names to the sexual harassment thread.

Give me some ideas.

Chuck Berry?

Gerry Rafferty? John Cafferty? The whole Beaver Brown Band?

Ricky Danko? No... no, not Ricky...

>> I wonder if Uncle Sam will ever be able to listen to Pigpens music again. Your mistake is that you're thinking the art/artist separation goes both ways, which it doesn't. It was pretty creepy when Pigpen would sing about not caring if a girl was underage -- but that was the music and the onstage persona. By all accounts, Pig offstage was a quiet loner who was mostly into older women. The art may have been somewhat sketchy, but I don't have reason to believe he actually was harassing underage girls. 

Louis CK goes the other direction. It's not the art that's objectionable -- it's the artist. And when that's true, they can't be separated.

Also -- men don't get to decide what women can or can't be traumatized by. There's no "walk it off" for sexual harassment and assault. That attitude is part of why we have such a problem -- it's not just because of the men who commit the harassment and assault, but because of the men who don't think it's a big deal and don't listen to women when they say it is.

Stay good Pony Girl.

What are you talking about, Uncle Sam Louie goes in the other direction? Whatever that means. Seems like Piglen is directly advocating for sexual assault of a minor. Is that the other direction? 

>>>it's not just because of the men who commit the harassment and assault, but because of the men who don't think it's a big deal and don't listen to women when they say it is.

Ah. There it is.

It's not just the men who committed these crimes; it's all men, you see.

It's not all men, just those who perpetrate or excuse it.

I guess we'll need to throw the female industry assistants, executives, and power players into that camp as well.

Grateful Dead Fan Sends Women Unsolicited Dick’s Picks

http://thehardtimes.net/news/grateful-dead-fan-sends-women-unsolicited-d...

Grateful Dead Fan Sends Women Unsolicited Dick’s Picks

http://thehardtimes.net/news/grateful-dead-fan-sends-women-unsolicited-d...

Why is it all men, Mark? Do you see some of yourself in there and that's why you identify Uncle Sam's statement as an indictment of all men? Guilt by association?

I think Stringwang is correct - it's not all men.

And is it possible that those female industry assistants, etc were also caught up in the abuse of power from (males in higher and influential positions) above and though not sexually harassed themselves - they were still silenced by that power and it's abuse?

Hush, Six. 

Yes, hush 6. You're apparently getting to close to something that makes Mark uncomfortable.

The only thing that makes uncomfortable in this discussion are deeply emasculated, creepy, desperate beta men like Harvey Weinstein and yourself.

Nice try at deflection - but I think your words and reactions above speak enough about you that I don't have to add any more to this discussion.

I've heard about this. Disappointing

So many double and triple standards being expressed here.

While it's perfectly normal and acceptable to "whack it"  in the Bank line,  or Post Office,  or DMV,  it's considered 'bad'  in a legally - rented hotel room.

Everyone is so PC these days.  Back in the 70's,  men and women would pleasure themselves in Supermarkets and Department Stores all day long.

Now only Monkeys at the Zoo are allowed.  How times have changed.

#dickpic 

No need to besmirch Jen poz, slacker

>>>but I think your words and reactions above speak enough about you that I don't have to add any more to this discussion.

Right. How dare I satirize knee jerk gender bashing by virtue signaling jackoffs; or question who might have been complicit in the predatory institutional sexual assault culture in Hollywood beyond what chromosomes a person carries.

Obviously that makes me guilty of something.

>>> it's not just because of the men who commit the harassment and assault, but because of the men who don't think it's a big deal and don't listen to women when they say it is. <<<

This.

This is about men not listening, not being outraged that women, and some men, but primarily women, are harassed, abused, assaulted, subjected to men's use of power to get their rocks off. Have you ever been in the position of having to decide (on the spot, right now!) how to deal with the sexual advances of someone who is more powerful than you, a boss, a celebrity, someone who is in some way holding power? Most likely not, because you're a man.

Hear women who have felt harassed, abused, assaulted, subjected to men's use of power to get their rocks off, or to hold power over them. Listen, act.

Most of you guys sound like you think this isn't serious, isn't important. Just imagine that it's your daughter, your mother, your sister, your partner... I hope it never is. You put 6 down for his statement, he's listening. Stringtwang knows, others may have said something empathetic, thank you.

Have some fucking empathy. I don't care if you like the guy's art, but that you feel for the women who've been traumatized.

>>>>>>I don't have to add any more to this discussion.

empty threats.

>>>This is about men not listening

Bullshit. This is about individual men who committed crimes.

>> What are you talking about, Uncle Sam Louie goes in the other direction? Whatever that means. Seems like Piglen is directly advocating for sexual assault of a minor. Is that the other direction? 

I'll see if I can clarify. If we're talking in terms of separating art from the artist, Pigpen made art that was maybe a little questionable, but there was never any evidence that he, the artist, did anything wrong in his non-stage life. So you can separate the art (a little creepy) from the artist (presumably innocent). Louis CK, in contrast, has made art that's basically fine, but his off-stage behavior was unacceptable.

So with Pigpen, the art was questionable, but the artist was fine. With CK, the art is fine, but the artist is not. That's why there's a difference.

What about Warren Zevon?  He did some terrible things as a person but I really love his art.

Bob Weir has totally done some underage plowing.  You want my copy of Ace?

Aristotle believed women were incomplete men, do we discount all his philosophy?

>>> It's not just the men who committed these crimes; it's all men, you see.

Judit already articulated it better than I can, but you're missing the point. Not all men are guilty of sexual harassment and assault, but the attitudes of some in this thread that it's not a big deal and women should get over it are part of the reason why men who actually do commit these crimes feel like they can get away with it.

It's certainly true that women in Hollywood/wherever else who have witnessed this behavior and done nothing have some responsibility to speak out too, but it's quite a bit different when the predator is your livelihood and you know if you speak up you'll be fired and blacklisted from the industry for life. It doesn't make it okay, but there are understandable forces pushing in the other direction. To get the culture to change, men in powerful positions in the film industry and elsewhere who have no reason to do nothing besides making money and not caring have to step up.

>>>This is about men not listening

Bullshit. This is about individual men who committed crimes. <<<

This is about years and years of men ignoring the facts. They've heard about it, and said and done nothing.

It's not just about crimes, it's about who is held responsible for their actions and that the culture hasn't changed.

>>>it's about who is held responsible for their actions

i don't know what I did

Wrong again, Judit.

We have a whole slew of sexual assault laws and a criminal justice system designed to punish these crimes.

To levy the accusation that men haven't done enough to deal with these crimes is totally disingenuous.

>> What about Warren Zevon?  He did some terrible things as a person but I really love his art.

I'm actually not familiar with his background beyond the alcoholism, but I don't think he was ever accused of sexual assault. If it had to do with bad shit within his family, I think we have a little different standard for that as long as it doesn't rise to physical or sexual violence. In terms of Bobby, you can keep Ace, but if multiple women came out and said he assaulted them in the 70s we might have some tough questions to confront. 

Bobby's playing is enough for me to part ways with the guy.

>>>>>>>but the attitudes of some in this thread that it's not a big deal and women should get over it are part of the reason why men who actually do commit these crimes feel like they can get away with it.

I totally agree.  It’s pretty disgusting.  I was in the mountains yesterday and haven’t had a chance to read the whole thread.  Who said it’s not a big deal and women should get over it?

Edgar Allen Poe?

I said >>> It's not just about crimes, it's about who is held responsible for their actions and that the culture hasn't changed. <<<

>>> To levy the accusation that men haven't done enough to deal with these crimes is totally disingenuous. <<<

Disingenuous? That is in no way true, Mark. I am sincere and believe completely that misogyny and the balance of power, where women have rarely been listened to and given credence to in industry, politics, etc., has led to my statements. As things are changing, I hope the culture of imbalance is changing, too.

>>>Who said it’s not a big deal and women should get over it?<<<

nobody in this thread. a few of us have spoken about things like society's reaction to sexual issues, seperating the art from the artist, personal struggles/forgiveness, or the mire of what constitutes consent or harassment, and the effects that a position of power can have, or not have, on that.

but i dont think anyone here has implied that its not a big deal and the women need to get over it.

>>>This is about years and years of men ignoring the facts. They've heard about it, and said and done nothing.<<<

as if we have some secret men's cabal where we all gather every month to discuss our continued cultural domination? like the facts were brought in a classified dossier to the secret men's cabal and we all collectively decided to seal them in some underground chamber beneath the bohemian grove?

putting that on all men by just making blanket statements about "men" doing this and "they" do that would be the same as me making comments about how most crime in the country is committed by "the blacks" and "they" need to work on their criminal culture.

yeah, a larger percentage of crime in this country is committed by african-americans, but that does not mean that black people as a group are responsible for that, or that something is wrong with their culture as a whole.

most men i know are just trying to treat people well, get thru life, find a good job, good friends and a good partner. maybe see some shows or take some hikes. i have yet to meet the men who constitute "the patriarchy".

i think so many issues these days mistakenly target gender and race, when it not really a gender or race issue, its an issue of power and of the culture of the wealthy and powerful. lots of women in those positions ignore abuse as well.

Ah yes, Judit. The patriarchy.

That explains why Louis CK was jacking off in front of those women.

It certainly explains why you are such a condescending dick.

Ah yes, Judit. The patriarchy.

That explains why Louis CK was jacking off in front of those women.

I take it you're being sarcastic. Otherwise, I see no explanation for your putting those together and I don't understand it even then...

No, I'm guessing that he got off doing it.

I don't know what to say right now to give you (and Daylight) the information needed for you to see that it was/is not the patriarchy, nor a cabal that made these incidents what they were. It was, however, that men in power have used that power to harass and assault others (mostly women).

>>>>>>that men in power have used that power to harass and assault others (mostly women).

I think that’s not true for every man in power and that is Daylight and Marks point

Had I said "every man", that point would be well-taken.

>> It was, however, that men in power have used that power to harass and assault others (mostly women).

And other men have participated in a culture, separate from any individual instance of harassment, that is skeptical of women's allegations, often downplays the seriousness of assaults, chooses to ignore or forgive known despicable behavior because of the alleged offender's positive attributes, and deflects valid criticism of the culture with absurdities and finger-pointing. It doesn't make those men evil or and they certainly shouldn't be equated with the actual assaulters, but by expressing these attitudes, they participate in the maintenance of a society that tolerates and condones assault.

Thanks, UncleSam, yes.

>>>>>>And other men have participated in a culture, separate from any individual instance of harassment, that is skeptical of women's allegations, often downplays the seriousness of assaults, chooses to ignore or forgive known despicable behavior because of the alleged offender's positive attributes, and deflects valid criticism of the culture with absurdities and finger-pointing

In this thread?

I've never watched Mad Men.

>> I take it you're being sarcastic

I was, yes. I also admit some women sound like the teacher from The Peanuts to me when they're talking.

Timmy, I don't speak for Uncle Sam, but whether or not it's in this thread, it's the larger culture that this whole question is coming from.

Mark,  are you referring to me? I've never heard that person.

No, I'm not referring to you, Judit. That was sarcasm. 

Off topic, but you aren't familiar with the classic Charlie Brown animated shows? 

Here's an episode. In this one, Charlie Brown invites Lucy over and surprises her by jacking off on a football.

It's actually pretty disturbing.

https://youtu.be/Dp0AOYogmGo

I had a coworker accuse me of sexual harassment. One day she said that she was psyched that we could be “real” with each other, swear, tell dirty jokes, etc. She even took it upon herself to show me pussy pics of her boyfriend’s Online lover. A few days later she filed some offbeat claim against me.

The shit threw me for a loop. She had never asked me to stop, and had actively participated, at a dirtier level than me. I got the big smack-down from HR. I have no idea why it even happened in the first place. 

A few weeks later she levied some other charge against me, that was just outrageous. At that point I told my lawyer to tell the company lawyer I wanted out, and that I wanted to be paid until the end of the contract year. They very quietly agreed. I think that, at that point, they knew that the woman had lied about a lot of stuff.

You live and learn. I no longer even tell coworkers that something looks good on them. Fuck that shit. When a female coworker has said that I look good, or my hair looks good, I tell them that it’s not okay to comment on how something looks on a person. 

Off topic, but you aren't familiar with the classic Charlie Brown animated shows

I know of them, watched parts of maybe a few. Never got into them, I guess.

Uncle Sam, sounds like you’re just giving Pigpen a pass because your a fan, but you sit here and try to give a clinic on feminism. If any music/movie star said “I don’t care if she’s only 14 yrs of age” today then it would make the same headlines as this Louis CK story. On that note though there is evidence of John Mayor doing virtually the same thing and allegations as well. Crickets on that subject. I guess Louie admitted this was true or are these still just allegations? If they are still just allegations and there is no proof then it looks like he’s in the same boat as Pig, as “questionable” by your standards. Again, there’s stories about the Beatles committing sexual abuse. John Lennon’s abuse to women physically. So we should stop playing their music on the radio? Honestly just wondering. Seems like your kinda backing away from your original stance.

Pretty funny the feminist rants by Uncle Sam. “I don’t care if she’s  only 14 yrs of age”, only questionable to him though.

Seems like I might have touched a nerve here

Nope. Just funny how stupid you sound in this thread.

Seems like some projection both in your post and your username

I've actually been trying to agree with you on separating artist from the art, I just don't think it makes sense when it's the artist and not the art that's offensive. But please feel free to continue calling me a feminist as if that's some sort of insult

In fairness, male feminists are pretty creepy. 

You can be cool with women and not self-identify with a female-specific political movement.

You’re the only feminist ever who’s down with statutory rape. 

Born to the fanfare of World War II victory parades, Pigpen grew up listening to the blues. His father was a boogie-woogie pianist and R&B DJ on Berkeley radio in the early ‘50s, known as “Cool Breeze”. 
Pigpen said in ‘66: “I began singin’ at 16. I wasn’t in school; I was just goofin’. I’ve always been singing along with records – my dad was a disc jockey, and it’s been what I wanted to do.”

http://deadessays.blogspot.com/2011/04/pigpen-solo.html?m=1

>>  Briank on Saturday, November 11, 2017 – 04:37 pm

I had a coworker accuse me of sexual harassment. One day she said that she was psyched that we could be “real” with each other, swear, tell dirty jokes, etc. She even took it upon herself to show me pussy pics of her boyfriend’s Online lover. A few days later she filed some offbeat claim against me.

The shit threw me for a loop. She had never asked me to stop, and had actively participated, at a dirtier level than me. I got the big smack-down from HR. I have no idea why it even happened in the first place. 

A few weeks later she levied some other charge against me, that was just outrageous. At that point I told my lawyer to tell the company lawyer I wanted out, and that I wanted to be paid until the end of the contract year. They very quietly agreed. I think that, at that point, they knew that the woman had lied about a lot of stuff.

You live and learn. I no longer even tell coworkers that something looks good on them. Fuck that shit. When a female coworker has said that I look good, or my hair looks good, I tell them that it’s not okay to comment on how something looks on a person.  <<

>> Relates story of being reprimanded for sexual harassment

>> Blames the woman

I think this is more your speed, BrianK. And also, just to be clear:

>> I had a coworker accuse me of who had me reprimanded for sexually harassing her

That was the proper lead in. Enjoy.

Classy.

Unlike you, I’m not afraid to share something personal. I also knew that some idiot could use it in the way you did. If you want to play that, go ahead. It all came out in the wash. I always own my shit. Always.

By the way, that post of yours was terrible. It shows how small you are. 

I think that being dismissed from a job shows how small you are, but I think we have different values and that's ok (although I don't think sexual harassment is ok and in that respect I think you're kind of a piece of shit).

I wasn’t dismissed, bonehead. She was.

Oh shit, what now? 

 Buddy, you are just not a nice person. If you want to get to me, you’re going to have to try harder than that. 

Maybe it’s time to take a break? You really suck at this.

Well I literally do have to take a break for now as I have a meeting but just to be clear in your cool story did you or did you not retain employment following allegations of misconduct in a professional setting? If not some might call that being dismissed.

Will check in with you later, bye for now.

Fully retained.

I was 100% honest in the HR questioning. I said what she claimed, and I admitted it. The oddity was that she was much worse than me. Like I said, she had no problem showing me pussy pics. I would never go that far. It made no sense to me that she was claiming harassment. It was mutual. I got a reprimand, which I accepted but made it clear I didn’t agree with. When they followed up with her, she claimed she was a saint. 

After the second allegation, a week or so later, which had zero to do with harassment, it became very clear to HR that she was full of shit. I got a formal apology and a buy-out, as long as I promised not to sue them. This was a very large employer with a “real” HR department. They don’t hand out that sort of shit unless they know they are in the crosshairs.

Why it happened in the first place, beats me. I stopped trying to figure it out. A number of coworkers told me that she clearly was infatuated with me. I’m oblivious to that shit, so I really couldn’t say. She and her fiancé had come to our house a few times, and my partner said that the way she stared at me and only talked to me made her very uncomfortable. Again, beats me, and I don’t really care.

I learned a ton from that experience. I had considered that coworker to be a close friend, not a work friend, and our relationship had that sort of tenor. We both bullshitted, and she was dirtier than me. Never again will that happen. Work is work, and I simply don’t go anywhere near that kind of banter.

So, does that explain it for you? Do you have more stupid shit to say about it that makes you look 10x worse than me?

And, there is a delicate irony to you talking about harassment of any sort. You harass people here all the time. I called you on it and you resorted to the total pussy shit up above. Own it and move on.

Who cares if he asked some girls if he could beat off in front of them?  We elected a man as President who was on tape bragging about being a sexual predator.  

"Grab 'em by the pussy!"

>>>>>>>> it became very clear to HR that she was full of shit. I got a formal apology and a buy-out, as long as I promised not to sue them. This was a very large employer with a “real” HR department. They don’t hand out that sort of shit unless they know they are in the crosshairs

What were they afraid you were going to sue them for?  It sounds like you were the liability they were trying to get rid of if they paid you out.  Sometimes it’s best to pay to make a problem go away before it gets worse and the problem is harder to get rid of.

Im not accusing you of anything, that’s just how I read it from an HR standpoint.

Not at all, Timmy. Not in the least. I think that that line about suing was boilerplate. I received a formal apology with an understanding that the events had created an unsafe working environment for me, as well as a bitchin’ letter of recommendation. After The initial shit they said they’d let me out of my contract, but with no recommendation or anything. After it all broke open, they were very quick to offer me all sorts of shit. On top of the formal apology, my direct supervisors both apologized to me in person, in tears. It was all surreal.

The whole situation sucked. It really sent me for a loop. I didn’t understand what happened, and why. Like I said, she was dirtier than me. It was fucked up. But, you live and learn.

>> she clearly was infatuated with me [...] the way she stared at me and only talked to me

I'm trying to make sense of that giant wall of bullshit you posted up there, but what I gather is: You're saying she was asking for it. Got it.

>> Fully retained.

>> I wanted to be paid until the end of the contract year. They very quietly agreed

Makes sense.

See Ateix, I knew that I was opening myself up by posting what I did, and that some douchebag would probably twist it for the sake of being a douchebag. You are “that guy,” the big winner. Congratulations. You should be proud of yourself.

Fave it, dude, you’re one of the biggest asshats around here. Your armchair quarterbacking means little. Run along and tell people how terrible their posts are. It’s your thing. Stick with it.

I don't believe Brian K's story.  

Is okay if you don’t believe it, JR. It has nothing to do with you. Like I said, I took a risk with that post, and I was hoping to open up dialogue about a serious topic. Instead what happened is that Ateix got all pussy-sore because I called him judgmental. He returned fire with a big bomb that is meaningless. Just more crap from a crappy Zoner who thinks his shit don’t stink.

Are you psyched that we can be all real up in here? Dirty and real.

I’ll leave you three drama queens to yourselves. You can be dirty and real without me. 

One thing we can be sure about is Brian’s coworker probably didn’t like eggs.

She loved eggs, and told me all about them many, many times, in theatrical detail. 

I think we can also be sure that no single poster in this thread owns the patent on being “small”.

So many (small) axes to grind, so many big trees. “Well sharp”.

Keep small axe dull - save the trees.

BK, after reading your short synopsis above, I would think it's safe to say you and she fucked up. Honestly, if you were married at the time or with a girlfriend, why have some stupid "friendship" with a chick where you were getting off talking dirty with her and viewing pornographic images on her phone? She opened up to you and must have felt you were into her. Foolish thing to caught up in. Sorry, dude. Just my take on it- not saying you're a horrible person.

And, I'm with you about work relationships. It's all about work for me at my job. Any intimate details can and will be used against anybody at any time. Glad you learned your lesson.

That's the exact lesson I learned, EB. I generally bantered with her, just stupid, inane and sometimes dirty shit. There was never anything physical or personal about my own life or hers, just stupid crap.She was much more personal and graphic (much, much more!), so I was like, whatever. We worked very closely and in tight quarters.

After that, though, I want no part of it. Coworkers tend to engage in that kind of banter, and I just walk the fuck away. I fully own my side of it. I was inappropriate at work, which set myself up. If I stay out of it, it's a non-issue.

Continues to blame the woman.

hahaha what a fucking creep.

Yep. FWIW, I'm guessing she's got some disturbing underlying issues. I hope she got help she obviously needs.

I know you're typing some long-ass drawn-out nonsense right now BrianK, spare yourself the effort, we're not gonna change each other's minds on this. You think I'm an internet meanie, because I have fun on a DBMB, and I think you're a straight creep, because you were seperated from employment after facing multiple allegations of sexual misconduct on the job.

Don't worry about it, big boy. I'm not.

lol

I’m only worried enough to point a shamey finger, but not to listen. If I listened, I might have to care and I don’t want to care.

No, Ateix, I think you are disgusting. To get back at me you bumped this thread with your bullshit accusations, which you are still making.  You have no clue what you're talking about. Objectively, how can you? Par for the course from you - just rude and douchey.The real irony is that this thread is about harassment. Day in and day out you demean, belittle, call names and harass people. I generally ignore you, but the other day you straight up sickened me when you made fun of someone's disability. Not only is that harassment, it's illegal. It says who you really are. 

So, you can judge me on a snippet that I gave, of something that happened years ago and you can't ever know about. Whatever. I'll judge you on what's here, now and real, something that we can all see. You're a dirtbag who has fun by treating people like crap. 

can i like both of you guys?

>> the other day you straight up sickened me when you made fun of someone's disability [citation needed]

You are actually asking me for a citation? The only citation you could give is the post where you edited my post, and that doesn't really count.

Something to do with Bob, and then you asked someone else if their spectrum disorder was worse than his.

Let me ask you, on any given day, how many people are you a dick to in your quest for fun? 3-6, would you say? They all deserve it, right, because they ask for it?

Illegal?

Lock him up!

Actually, it was Timmy Hoover who said, "I did.  Would you say you’re higher or lower on the spectrum than Sideshow Bob?"

It was a shitty thing to say.

There've been a lot of shitty things in the last few days; get rid of your fangs you guys, change your strain, take it somewhere else. Do whatever you do to take it down a notch or two.

Take it to TheRealZone.net, bruh. It's dirty.

It's ok. He's only been self diagnosed

I stand corrected. Sorry, Ateix. You didn't make fun of disabilities. You just put people down for fun. My bad.

It's weird because of all the times I've met Ateix, he's been a really nice guy.  And anyone else on here who has met him will say the same thing.  

Yeah BrianK likes to alter the truth to his liking. As I understand it, it actually contributed to the cost of a job for him a job at one point in his past.

Ateix...can you give me BK's Social Security number? Thanks, pal.

Yes, Sio - in person nice guy - something happens to him when the Viva/Gamma rays blast him here. 

Sio, when you mentioned you were coming into town for the Dead Co date, it was a reminder to be tempted to check out the show. Probably won't happen but if you are around real early / in town real late and feel like hitting me up, I should be around. May be scoping out a show myself but it'll most likely be shorter than Dead Co. Been way way too long.

...

>> can you give me BK's Social Security number?

Trying to avoid getting another shamey finger email, Ned. Is it ok if I send it as a private message? Watch your inbox.

(((brian k)))

Ateix, you don’t stop, do you? Tell us all how it makes you feel.

In the last 48 hours, how many people have you attacked, called names, berated, etc? Why don’t you tell me your truth, and then We can see if it jives with the truth as I’ve read it. You don’t have to count me.

a. 0

b. 1-3

c. 4-5

d. Over 5

>>> She loved eggs, and told me all about them many, many times, in theatrical detail. 

In the words of a great American, "Womp-bomp-a-loom-op-a-womp-bam-boom".

I wonder where Timmy puts himself on the spectrum, you know - before he speculates about someone else.

Gene Simmons...

https://archive.org/details/TerryGrossInterviewWithGeneSimmons

Gross!

Sara Silverman just did a good monologue about CK. https://youtu.be/_WKFDqxiL80

Simmons is a narcissist and douche. 

Simmons for President. 

Fox News Bans Gene Simmons for Life

https://www.thedailybeast.com/fox-news-bans-kiss-frontman-gene-simmons-f...

the last 25 or so posts in this thread are basically ateix and briank forcing us to watch them jerk off

"Everybody wants to change someone else's strain."

(sung to the tune of Jumping Someone Else's Train)

Six please stop with the emails thanks in advance

lol